sholio: Cisco from The Flash with hand out (Flash-Cisco)
Sholio ([personal profile] sholio) wrote2017-04-28 12:20 am

Catching up on TV feels

I am just poking my head up from massive, massive book edits. Even proofreading a 130K book takes forever. WHY DID I DO THIS TO MYSELF. It should be out early next week, though.

So, a catchup post on various recent TV-related stuff.

First of all, a vid rec: Fringe - Walter - 1985 by [personal profile] jmtorres. I never, ever would've thought of using 1985 for Walter, but it's such a hilarious and perfect song choice for him. Now I have Fringe feels.

This week's Flash: was certainly an episode of TV that happened.

When you've only got five episodes to the end of the season, it's really frustrating to get an episode that feels so much like filler.

I kept thinking about last season's time travel episode where Barry went back and encountered past!Eobard and Hartley. I LOVED THAT EPISODE. And this one just fell flat for me. There were things about it I liked (Cisco and Barry, especially) but in general I think the things that frustrated me most about this episode were, first of all, that none of it really matters since they're going to change all of it anyway. You can still have fun with an episode like that when you learn new things about the characters, but all the characters' dystopic futures were just so flat. And most of them hinged around Barry ruining people's lives by being a self-centered jerk. I actually am in the probably 10% of the fandom who does not think that canon Barry is a self-centered jerk, but boy, he sure was in this episode. (I did like that even our Barry had 0% patience with his future self. STOP CHANNELING YOUR INNER OLIVER, BARRY.)

But yeah, for an episode that was entirely about the future fates of the characters, there just wasn't any there there. Nobody's really changed at all in 8 years except to get a little more depressed and lonely (except for HR, who apparently is incapable of having deep emotional reactions to anything), and the only person who will be affected by any of this is present!Barry anyway; the city is the most flimsily dystopic dystopia ever (the only bad consequence of Barry quitting superheroing, beyond making his friends sad, seems to be that two of the show's less-effective villains are now committing more robberies?), and while he DID get a useful clue to take back to the past, I still can't believe Cisco invented a device that interferes with Barry's ability to use his speed, and none of the characters thought that this might be useful against, oh, say, the main speedster villain of the season.

This episode also made me very aware that, of their major female characters, one is dead in the future, one is evil, and one (if you can still count Jesse as a main character) is apparently permanently offworld and forgotten, which means the "getting the band back together" was literally all dudes. Really, show?

At least it looks like we're going to get a reveal on Savitar next week, FREAKING FINALLY. The tag scene suggests that it might be Ronnie, except that makes absolutely zero logistical sense, but I can't think of who else might've made Caitlin react like that. I think at this point they've dragged out the reveal so long that it's going to be anti-climactic and probably contradictory to previous episodes no matter who it is.



This week's Agents of SHIELD: continues to be my favorite thing on TV right now, and I STILL can't believe I'm saying that about THIS SHOW.

I really can't believe that Ward is still alive. Pretty sure that the writers know everyone is expecting him to die and are trolling us, especially this episode, between Coulson's "don't die" and then staying behind to guard the radio station at the end while everyone else escapes AFTER having a heartfelt goodbye with Daisy - yeah, now they're just messing with us. Not that I'm complaining.

I also had a thought while I was watching about the way they're playing Good!Ward as opposed to Real!Ward, which is the way that he's so respectful of Daisy's autonomy. Once he understands that she's not Skye, he notices immediately that he's making her uncomfortable by touching her and stops, and he makes an effort to call her by the name she prefers, even though it must be incredibly weird for him. (Asking her about her real name, back in the first Framework episode, was probably the moment when I tipped over into "okay, yes, I like him GODDAMMIT SHOW".) I also love that the point of divergence between this Ward and our Ward is after the fire and his jail time and not before, because it really plays into the show's current theme that we aren't really inherently good or bad, it's the people who influence us and the choices we make that cause us to be so.

I think the whole idea of the characters' bodies being in the care of homicidal robots who really WANT to kill them but can't, because of their programming, is perhaps the most wonderfully creepy thing this show has ever come up with. The tension is really ratcheting up. I also don't know how to feel about the fact that the show has now introduced a plausible means of bringing back actual, living versions of anyone who is currently alive in the Framework. tbh, I think the fact that there are so many people they COULD do it to is the biggest argument that they won't do it to anyone, because I'm not sure if they could get away with it for just one character without fans of the other characters screaming bloody murder. If they do it with anyone, I'm going to guess that it'll be Hope (or else Mack will opt to stay in the Framework with her, which, NOOOO, but I've seen people suggesting that the Framework might stick around and some characters, such as Ward, might voluntarily opt to stay behind and fix things there, which is pretty plausible, and if that IS an option, it's hard to see Mack going back to the real world without her).



This week's Supergirl: made me have conflicted thoughts about my least favorite character(s).

Okay, so, I can't STAND Snapper Carr. But the frustrating thing is that he's actually right most of the time. The show drove me up the absolute freaking wall the first season with the sheer do-not-want of the entire Cat Grant approach to news, which is "decide what you want people to feel, then provide information to make them feel that way/cover up anything to make them feel otherwise". And that's ... honestly, probably not inaccurate for how major corporate news works, but REALLY FUCKING CREEPY when it's coming from well-intentioned characters we're supposed to sympathize with, in light of actual real-world events lately. Let's just say that marathoning the series in the months following last fall's election was, uh, NOT the time to sell me on a character whose entire life is devoted to using news media to manipulate the public. I'm not sure if I hate Cat Grant, but I was vastly glad she's not on the show this season because just seeing her makes my eye twitch.

Except Snapper Carr is SO MUCH WORSE.

Except he's actually right about the journalistic ethics thing! And I keep wondering if there's a possibility that a lot of the way the show handles Snapper and Kara is actually a direct counterpoint to the the skeevier aspects of Cat's reporting style. (I feel like this would be giving the writers too much credit, though.) I really loved the theory of Kara having an older female mentor, but couldn't stand the character they gave her. In practical terms, as far as teaching her about being a reporter, Snapper is a much better mentor. Except he's so. fucking. irritating. In pretty much every way. And literally one of my biggest character-relationship buttons is "grouchy older mentor and young female mentee", and it is incredibly frustrating that both Cat and Kara, and Snapper and Kara's relationship epically fails to hit that button because I just hate watching them interact with each other. But I think under Snapper's guidance, she'll actually end up being a pretty good reporter. I just want him on screen as little as possible.

Dammit, show.

However, by the end of the episode I was totally down with a James/Winn/Lyra threesome. Some aspects of that plot frustrated me, but A+ cute character shenanigans.

A+ Kara & Mon-El sneaking-around shenanigans, too. KARA AND MON-EL INVESTIGATIONS. I'm there for it. I think I like the show best when the characters are just running around having hijinks while solving comparatively minor crimes. They're all so cute, and the actors are such darlings, and could we just have a whole season of that kind of thing?

However, I can't WAIT for next week, which looks completely up my h/c-loving street, and promises to have lots of Alex and Maggie feels. Fingers crossed the show will also manage to give James and Winn a teeny bit of screentime, or at least not forget that they (particularly James) exist.

the_rck: (Default)

[personal profile] the_rck 2017-04-28 11:30 am (UTC)(link)
I think my problem with future Barry on this week's episode was that we've seen how Barry reacts to losing people who are important to him, and I didn't find that consistent with becoming a sulking hermit. I could buy him doing something grand and stupid and dying from it. I could buy him getting grim and more Punisher style vicious (which would definitely alienate his allies). I could also see him taking off to wander the multiverse. He'd say that was just for a while, until he got his head together, but it wouldn't be.

Of course, options one and three would make tracking him down to talk to him pretty difficult.

Snapper Carr has the ethics part of journalism down, but when I see him, I can't figure out how he'd ever get a reluctant person to talk to him or how he'd manage to steer an interview to get a better response from the person he's talking to. There's some evidence that he manipulates Kara, so maybe we're not seeing all of him, but... If he showed up to interview me, I'd probably slam the door on him. He's probably good at the writing/researching part, though.

I had an easier time with Cat Grant because I never actually felt like CatCo was a genuine news organization. I couldn't actually figure out what on earth the people who worked there actually did, though.
the_rck: (Default)

[personal profile] the_rck 2017-05-01 02:00 am (UTC)(link)
I have a suspicion that the main reason CatCo had to be a news empire was so that bringing in James as a coworker made sense.

I could believe what Julian was doing and what HR was doing. I don't think Cisco would still be in Central City, though, because, even without powers, I think he'd want a place where he could do something useful. And that's without considering that he has friends on other Earths who might have access to ways to help him out or to help Wally out.

The way that Joe was acting, eight years out, made me wonder why he and Wally were still alive.
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-28 04:32 pm (UTC)(link)
We saw the first ep of that plotline last night and it was great! A lot more like the show I used to enjoy, before the Inhumans stuff went off the rails for me in S2. That actress who plays Jemma and Ming-Na are outstanding. And the way Coulson said "Daisy," aww.

It's sad they're going to do a limited number of eps with this, it's such a great typical sf idea.
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-29 05:52 am (UTC)(link)
WE JUST HIT THE NEVERTHELESS SHE PERSISTED LINE OH MY GOD
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-29 07:01 am (UTC)(link)
we're staying up too late to bingewatch through the last one /o\

MAYYYYYYYYY HOW IS MAY SO AWESOME why do I not have a May icon
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-29 04:49 pm (UTC)(link)
This is just so totally my fucking catnip. They are trapped in a hostile reality! But it's the same as their own! But not quite! And they have to figure out how to deal with the people they do/don't know! I could watch a whole season of this, seriously.

And I really loved that the final emphasis wasn't on how "real" anyone was (and wasn't that also in the LMD arc?) -- Jemma felt empathy for Hope and then Trip and the Patriot (whom I actually liked, that was weird) and you had Phil going "Maybe the solution to our problem is to fix theirs" and I was just like YESSS because I also love that setup, heh. Actually I wanted to see MORE of Trip, that actor is just so good and I missed him so much. But even if they were "just" snippets of code, they could still feel and act, they were like people, which is very sf. (This arc plus the LMD story is very Philip K. Dick, actually.)

Ming-Na is awesome because it was like you could actually see a little bit of May coming back, right near the end, and Phil too -- when he said "Snap out of it, May!" so familiarly and her face changed, I loved it. (I don't like this show! I ragequit it years ago! WTF?)

Chloe Bennett also really sold the scene with Daisy and Ward, how hesitant she was about saying she didn't understand him until she met this Ward -- it doesn't retcon him, which I like, but it did let you see how he could have been a good person without letting him off the hook. It was all just great.
Edited (LOL I liked it so much I forgot HTML tags) 2017-04-29 16:50 (UTC)
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-29 05:56 am (UTC)(link)
Jemma is great! and I didn't like Mace much, but he had that great speech in telling Jemma what he cared about was real -- and OMG now Mme Creepy is making Daisy her terrible offer. //chews nails

And Mack and Hope! OH MY HEART.
selenay: (never trained)

[personal profile] selenay 2017-04-28 05:22 pm (UTC)(link)
I really can't believe that Ward is still alive.

I genuinely expected him to die at the end of this episode and I was so surprised when a) it didn't happen and b) I was happy about that.

it's the people who influence us and the choices we make that cause us to be so.

This is something I've been thinking about this week. It's also interesting to me that the people who have ended up so different, so fundamentally at-the-core different, are the two people who had changes that began at a point in their lives when they were malleable. It was the presence or absence of other people at such crucial times that made them radically different. You can argue that May and Coulson are still the same, just under the surface, but Ward and Fitz really, really aren't.

I genuinely don't know how they're going to resolve this plot in a way that doesn't make someone hurt, but I'm looking forward to seeing what they do.
selenay: (Default)

[personal profile] selenay 2017-05-01 12:55 pm (UTC)(link)
the big difference between their Framework and canon selves hinged upon the biggest influence on their early lives being a female vs. a male role model, mentor, and primary shaper-of-identity

Ooh, now that's a thought I hadn't had before! It's definitely interesting, although as you need, with Aida as the architect it's hard to know how much of that was intentional. There are so many interesting layers to the Framework.
schneefink: River walking among trees, from "Safe" (Default)

[personal profile] schneefink 2017-04-28 09:21 pm (UTC)(link)
the characters' bodies being in the care of homicidal robots who really WANT to kill them but can't, because of their programming
That does sound wonderfully creepy.
If I was only interested in checking out this storyline, where should I start?
schneefink: River walking among trees, from "Safe" (Default)

[personal profile] schneefink 2017-04-29 09:40 pm (UTC)(link)
I watched half of season 1 and the CA:WS direct tie-in episodes, so I know the very basics, just enough to be very interested in a mirror 'verse.
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-29 05:58 am (UTC)(link)
We started watching just at 4x16 and it makes sense, altho we did see all of S1 and I think half of S2.
schneefink: River walking among trees, from "Safe" (Default)

[personal profile] schneefink 2017-04-29 09:41 pm (UTC)(link)
Good to know :)
lynnenne: (shield: the smart cute one)

[personal profile] lynnenne 2017-04-28 11:21 pm (UTC)(link)
Re: SHIELD, my theory is that real Fitz will end up dead and Evil Fitz will come out of the Framework. Because Whedons are JUST THAT CRUEL.
lynnenne: (shield: the smart cute one)

[personal profile] lynnenne 2017-04-28 11:40 pm (UTC)(link)
They sort of hinted at it when Evil Fitz said, "Take me with you" to Ada. If she can build a human body for herself, why not for him? She can dump all of his code into the new Fitz body and kill the old one.

It would break Jemma's heart, and heartbreak is what Whedons do.
lynnenne: (shield: the smart cute one)

[personal profile] lynnenne 2017-04-29 02:17 pm (UTC)(link)
OOOOOOH, I hadn't thought of that! That would be so creepy.
sherylyn: (Default)

[personal profile] sherylyn 2017-04-29 12:22 am (UTC)(link)
Oh good heck. Yeah, that's horrible and **way too plausible**!! ARGH!!!
lynnenne: (shield: the smart cute one)

[personal profile] lynnenne 2017-04-29 02:20 pm (UTC)(link)
WHEDONS ARE EVOL. Which, TBH, is kind of why I keep watching their shows.
sherylyn: (Default)

[personal profile] sherylyn 2017-04-29 05:51 pm (UTC)(link)
LOL Yeah, they totally, totally are!! ARGH!!

And also, on a totally random topic, I love your screen name! "Lynne" is my actual middle name, and it's just not that common to see even a variation of it used anywhere! (Sherylyn = a slightly oddball combination of my first and middle names: Sherry Lynne ;-))
lynnenne: (mood: insane in the brain)

[personal profile] lynnenne 2017-05-02 02:32 am (UTC)(link)
Thank you! Lynne is my middle name, too, even though it's the name I've answered to all my life. I blame my parents.
yalumesse: (Peggy)

[personal profile] yalumesse 2017-04-29 12:47 am (UTC)(link)
I hadn't figured out why this week's Flash bothered me so much till you said that: it was filler. Only thing that came out of it was the name of a scientist to be introduced next week and a chance for the actors to wear some new hairpieces :(

No guesses on who Savitar is. I don't think it's Ronnie. I thought the man was black, from the glimpse we got, but can't see why on rewatch. Also got the feeling that whoever it was scares Caitlin more than anything. That anger management guy they interviewed for Firestorm comes to mind, but no idea how. Probably someone new.



SHIELD IS AWESOME RIGHT NOW. (flail flail I want to see Victoria Hand 'raising' Ward. I'll be trawling the Ao3 tags until someone writes it.) I don't think they're going to save Ward AND Trip AND Hope and god knows who else; I suspect they'll fi the plot so that after Aida only one person can get out / someone will sacrifice themselves to give others time to escape / etc, and that'll be the excuse for not saving them all. Ward already did the stay-behind sacrifice so I don't think they'll do that again, but if it's Trip again all our hearts will shatter. If Mack stays with Hope... I hadn't thought of that :'(


*hugs* Snapper's an awful person with solid morals. Well written character, but 100% deserves the hate. I used to think he was going to grow into the sort of Tough Mentor boss, but this week he was just petty.

Funny thing? I loved Lyra/Winn up till this episode, and now I'm grumpy about Lyra. I get that before she was playing a role to make Winn help her steal, but I liked that Lyra better. Her temper tantrum here was really infantile. I could see the threesome, but right now it feels like 'Winn and James teaching Lyra to be less animalistic' which... not a dynamic I like.

Karamel is AMAZING those two are ADORABLE my heart is MELTING I cannot even. squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-29 06:09 am (UTC)(link)
They CAN'T kill Trip again, that was the reason I quit watching this damn show in the first place!
kore: (Default)

[personal profile] kore 2017-04-29 11:59 pm (UTC)(link)
Man they are setting this up to be just heartbreaking. I can't imagine Mack leaving his little girl, or them killing off Trip AGAIN. Maybe Not-So-Evil Ward going out in a burst of glory, altho Patriot kind of already did that?

It was a bit 'can't stop the signal'-ish but when Good Dude burst in and was all "There's people outside, I think they want to help us!" I was all AWWW. Now I don't want the people in the Framework to just be wiped! Damn you, Whedons.
yalumesse: (Default)

[personal profile] yalumesse 2017-04-30 08:36 am (UTC)(link)
Yeah, at this point everything's been done already for one character or another. Maybe they'll be creative with the how?
yalumesse: (Default)

[personal profile] yalumesse 2017-04-29 11:26 pm (UTC)(link)
I get the feeling Savitar is one of those Our Destiny villains, knows what the future is supposed to be and is doing the opposite of Barry by being careful not to upset it.

Oo, ow, that Ward story hurts. I'll let you know if I find any good mentor!Victoria fics.

Yep, I know Hunger Games. Took me a while to warm to Haymitch, but now I really like him. Partly due to Fernwithy's epic canon-compliant HG-verse fic in which Hamitch plays a massive role; read any of that? (I super recommend it but it will literally take weeks to read.)

We can love something and still only complain about it. If we didn't love it we wouldn't care enough to complain/get mad/etc. But yeah, I'm hoping we can sweep Lyra's behavious this ep under the mental rug.

DETECTIVE MIKE MATTHEWS! Ohhhhh there's another whole fanfic universe plot bunny hatching. Damn you ;)

[personal profile] mikeda 2017-04-29 01:19 am (UTC)(link)
On Savitar.

Some people have suggested that Savitar may have been a time remnant of Barry.
the_rck: (Default)

[personal profile] the_rck 2017-05-01 02:11 am (UTC)(link)
That assumes that killing Iris is really what Savitar did/does/will do as opposed to what everyone thinks happened. I have no idea how it could be a fake out, but... It might actually make a more interesting story.

But that may be because I've been thinking about an anime/manga series where the villain does something of the sort.

Or maybe the Iris we've been seeing recently isn't the real Iris?

I don't know the storyline makes so very little sense.
sgatazmy: Peggy standing strong in a crowd of men (Default)

[personal profile] sgatazmy 2017-05-11 05:11 pm (UTC)(link)
I just caught up on SHIELD and had to come to DW to see if anyone here was caught up. I can't believe I am back to being fannish about this show because for a while it had gotten...eh. So much love for this arc!
Edited 2017-05-11 17:12 (UTC)