Just checking in (and rambling about fannish stuff, apparently)

[sholio]

Hi Internets!

I'm spending most of October visiting my sister, so I haven't been online much lately -- we're doing visiting stuff and traveling stuff instead! Though I do occasionally check into LJ/email just to make sure that I haven't missed anything major. (As the vacation wears on, however, the ratio of "travel/visit stuff" to "computer stuff" seems to be slowly shifting more in the direction of "computer" as I get increasingly burned out on traveling/exploring/playing boardgames/etc., and start to need more solitude. Such is the life of the introvert. On the other hand, I don't want to spend TOO much of the vacation retreating into the guest bedroom with my laptop.)

Signups for festivids end today. I'd been on the fence about signing up, but I just don't think I'm going to. I'd like to get back into making vids, though. This winter I'm planning to treat myself to a faster computer -- the reason I stopped making vids a year or so ago is that, basically, every time I try, my laptop overheats. I can do it, but I have to do it in 10-minute increments with long pauses in between. It's just not fun, and I'm afraid of damaging the computer, which would be an absolute disaster because all my writing is on here. (Backed up, obviously. But the idea of a complete hard drive meltdown horrifies me.) But I want to get a newer computer, and get back into it; I already have ideas for several vids I want to make, mostly for Carnivale, and I think I would have a lot more fun if I'm not vidding to a deadline.

I don't think I will be signing up for Yuletide for the same reason. I have too much RL going on right now, and too much original fic that I want to write; I'd have more fun doing my fannish things quietly in a low-pressure environment over the remaining months of the year.

I really don't know where I stand right now with regards to White Collar and being fannish about it. I suppose I'm in a sort of ... mesofannish period. *g* I still love the show and the characters and the actors. But it feels like I'm very out of step with the fandom, in terms of what people want out of the show and how people see the characters and so forth. This wasn't something that I even really noticed in the beginning, when I was in my first flush of "Ooh, new shiny!" and was swept up in it. But the deeper I get into the fandom, the more I'm withdrawing from the social side of it. I don't think I've posted a single thing about WC lately (fic, squee, meta, whatever) that hasn't ended up getting a few comments that make me hurt and annoyed and angry. These days, posting anything for White Collar doesn't make me happy and eager; it makes me anxious and depressed and nail-bitingly nervous about what I'll end up fighting about this time, and that's not at all the experience that I want out of a fandom.

And I feel bad for feeling this way, because my entire flist has been uniformly awesome and supportive and wonderful, and I know that even the upsetting comments are not trying to be malicious. I'm not fishing for petting here -- you guys have petted me lots! It's just that every time I think about posting something squeeful lately, I know I'll end up hurt and upset, and I decide it's not worth it.

... Well, and it helps that I'm traveling and not online much anyway. Actually, having a break from fandom has ended up making me miss it a lot. I want to write fic and talk about shows and so forth, and taking some time away from it has made me realize that I really do miss it. I just don't know how I can manage to get the fannish experience that I want. Very strict comment guidelines in my journal, perhaps? But I don't want to scare people off from commenting entirely ... Can I get a thicker skin for Christmas?

And there's also the problem that Season 4, so far, has left me conflicted and unhappy about the Neal-Peter relationship, which is my main reason for watching and fanning on the show. I think that the way people reacted to Season 3 is largely how I've been reacting to Season 4. I really don't know how much of it is the show itself and how much is me being overly influenced by other people's opinions (another reason why I'm trying not to interact with the fandom much), but it's not just that because I was still rather unhappy and conflicted about it, even after I stopped reading episode reactions. I've always seen their relationship as slightly messed up, but more in an adorable way than a bad way -- that is, I saw it more as "their fondness for each other can overcome all their differences" rather than the two of them being actively bad for each other. Now ... I guess now I mostly just want to see them get out of each other's lives. (Well, at the moment I guess it's mostly that I think Neal is very actively not-good for Peter. Which is not to say that Peter hasn't screwed up too, rather majorly in a couple of cases this season. I've gotten very knee-jerk defensive of Peter mainly because I see a lot of people judging Peter without also judging Neal at the same time -- it's not that I think Peter is completely without blame so much as I think any blame to go around has to be shared.)

Most of the stories I want to write at the moment are essentially breakup fic: a major falling out that ends with the two of them never seeing each other again. (See also: the ending of the dragon story, which is really not how that story was slated to end when I first started working on it, but is a pretty accurate metaphor for how I see their relationship and the inevitable end of it.)

... and yet, I still have this huge soft spot for total fluff, and personally I don't want to read fic in which they're dysfunctional and unhappy. And I go back and forth on how I feel about them on the show anyway, because even though I don't feel good about how they've been lately, they apparently think it's worth it, even with all the ups and downs. And I don't want to be super-judgey about them anyway -- I've always felt that if two people are happy with their relationship as it is, then it's not anyone else's business to judge it as "dysfunctional" if it doesn't conform to someone else's idea of how friendship (or romance, or parent-child, or whatever) ought to be. I guess that what's changed for me with Peter & Neal is that I'm not sure anymore if they are happy with it, or at least, I'm not convinced that they're happier with it than they'd be without it, which is my basic definition of a dysfunctional relationship anyway.

I guess Peter and Neal are making me unhappy these days because they're making each other so unhappy, and I don't really ever see it stopping. If all that happened in season 3 didn't have any effect, how are they ever going to stop disappointing each other and hurting each other and lying to each other and risking each other's lives/career/marriage/happiness?

I rewatched 4x05 "Honor Among Thieves" recently -- mostly because I was thinking about writing an AU taking off from the episode and dealing with the investigation into Ellen's death. That episode hurt the first time. It hurt less the second time around, but I'm still trying to figure out the extent to which Neal was playing Peter at the end. If he even is. I guess that I'm still uncertain how much of what he said to the lady thief (I've forgotten her name) and later to Peter was true, about not wanting the information because the cost of it was too high, and how much of it was simply a calculated attempt to get it by way of Peter instead. If he was really telling the truth -- if he refused to accept the flash drive because he didn't want to get it at the cost of lying to/betraying Peter, even if no one ever knew he'd done that -- then that's a huge thing for Neal. But I really don't know, mostly because what he says to her in that scene sounds like it's calculated to be heard by outsiders. And yet, his surprise when the FBI shows up while he's on the phone to Peter looks genuine. I want to think that it is. But I just ... don't ... know.

Comments

[veleda_k]

Re: White Collar, I'm withholding judgment on Neal&Peter until the season returns. Because what I've noticed is that every time I'm just about ready to give up on the show, the writers do something to reassure me and pull me back in. And the second half of the season is traditionally the reconciliation half. But I do worry about what their long term relationship is going to be. Everyone involved with the show keeps saying that the minute the tension disappears from Neal and Peter's relationship, the show is over. So, I guess I wonder how much growth the writers will ever allow them to have. (This is one of the weird times when I separate characters and writers. I think the characters could grow and change, but will the writers let them?)

Honestly, from a practical standpoint, Neal has always been not-good for Peter. Not good career wise, legality wise, etc. Neal gets Peter into trouble. But before I felt that the benefits outweighed the risks. At this time, I'm not so sure I feel like that. But Peter and Neal's relationship has been compared to a marriage more than once, and I think they do have that level of investment in it. So, I think that Peter is willing to see where this goes, even though they've hit a rough spot. And, it just now occurs to me, while Neal could very possibly be career suicide for Peter, the longer Neal stays with Peter, the more he loses his old survival skills. I notice it less, because Peter stands to lose a lot that's really good and valuable, while Neal is gaining something good and leaving the bad. But for Neal it's more complicated than that. He wants this new life he's gaining, absolutely, but that doesn't mean it doesn't hurt to leave the old one behind.

I think Neal and Peter are both really uncomfortable right now. They realize they can't go back to being who they were, but they're not yet sure who they're becoming. My feeling is that Peter gets that, and is cutting Neal slack. (I think that, in his own particular way, Peter understands people even better than Neal does.)

So, yeah, I'm giving the writers a chance to make me feel better, since they always have before.

And I personally don't think Neal was playing Peter in "Honor Among Thieves." I don't think his interactions with Mozzie or the villain of the week in that episode support that reading (but that's just me). I do think it was natural for Peter to suspect that though.

I am sorry that you find fannish life so stressful. I know that I'd be sorry to lose your contributions. But I can get how you feel to a certain extent. I'm on the outskirts of fandom myself. Even when I like the popular characters and pairings, I tend to like them in unusual sorts of ways. I haven't been quite able to do what I've done in the past, which was create a circle of friends and communities that fit my tastes and never venture out. Maybe WC fandom is too small for that, or maybe it's something else. I guess the only suggestion I have is posting locked stuff, but that's probably occurred to you.

In a way I'm lucky, because I'm small name, and most of my stuff is sort of specialized anyway. Either you want to read Kate action fic, or Neal/Sara BDSM, or graphic Kate/Alex, or you don't. And if people don't, they're way more likely to simply ignore me.

But man, if you get a thicker skin for Christmas, direct me to the supplier. I am such a delicate, fragile flower, and it makes things not fun. I don't want to obsess over the fact that someone hates one of my favorites, but I can't seem to stop. And I want to explode all over my journal, but I don't, because throwing a hissy fit isn't going to accomplish anything besides landing myself on Fandom Wank.

So, um, yeah. When I build my perfect fannish island, you're totally invited.

[sholio]

It's always nice to know I'm not the only one who struggles with these things. <3 I think you might be right that WC fandom is too small to create the sort of pleasant little microcosm that it's possible to do in larger fandoms (which was what I did in SGA fandom, back in the day).

I am such a delicate, fragile flower, and it makes things not fun. I don't want to obsess over the fact that someone hates one of my favorites, but I can't seem to stop.

GAH. THIS. SO MUCH. I don't like being this way; it certainly doesn't make fandom any more fun for me. Things would be so much easier if I really didn't care what other people thought, if I could manage to navigate fandom without getting upset by opinions diametrically opposed to my own. But it's so hard to let go of it.

Neal gets Peter into trouble. But before I felt that the benefits outweighed the risks. At this time, I'm not so sure I feel like that.

Yeah, I think that's exactly where I am, too. There have always been risks, and I think the risks are greater for Peter (or, at least, are balanced with lesser rewards) because his life was so content and complete before Neal came into it. Neal stands to lose a lot (and yes, I agree with you that he's losing his survival skills and, even more than that, his coping mechanisms -- this was something that it took me awhile to recognize, that lying and stealing are Neal's fallbacks under stress, the way he insulates himself from a painful world, and learning to do things Peter's way means that he's having to learn how to relate to the world without having that armor). But he also stands to gain a lot, since his pre-Peter life was really not working out all that well (at least in the sense of his long-term prospects).

And this season is making me question whether the trade-offs in their give-and-take are really worth it -- for Peter especially, since Neal keeps jeopardizing his career, but also for Neal, who seemed to be relatively content on his island before Peter uprooted him again.

I think you're right, though, that they're both feeling uncertain right now, because they're both aware that they're changing but they're uncomfortable with who and what they're becoming. I hope the back half of the season will have a little more comfort to balance the hurt.

ETA: And you're totally welcome on my island too. <3

[veleda_k]

lying and stealing are Neal's fallbacks under stress, the way he insulates himself from a painful world, and learning to do things Peter's way means that he's having to learn how to relate to the world without having that armor

Yes, absolutely. I think Neal's cheerful, upbeat demeanor can make people forget just how much pain he's been through. What little we know indicates that his childhood wasn't exactly ideal, his entire sense of identity was built on a lie, he went to prison (sure he earned that sentence, but that doesn't make it fun or easy), his girlfriend died, his best friend almost died, he discovered that his mentor and former father figure was behind both events, then his mother figure died. The real world is painful, so Neal creates his own little world, one where life's an adventure and he's wildly successful. But this world isn't sustainable, and it hurts other people, so he's leaving it behind. But he doesn't have anything to replace it yet. He's in pain, and as you said, all of his coping skills are either gone or no longer working, so he's kind of a collection of undirected pain right now.

I think season three was a point-of-no-return for both Neal and Peter. Neal gives up on the score of a lifetime to stay in New York, while Peter risks his career to protect Neal. They're both willing to give up what they prize for each other. And that's great, but then what? Where do they go with that? I think season three raised more questions for them than it answered. This is the transition period. I can only hope that they come out the other side stronger and closer.

But it's so hard to let go of it.

As much as I'm sorry that you feel this stress, I'm sort of relieved to know that I'm not the only one who feels this way. It makes me feel less foolish.