Marvel announced Phase 4 at SDCC

[sholio]

Here's the list!

My unpopular(?) Marvel opinion is that I'm kinda hitting superhero burnout. I'm not that enthused about anything upcoming, and I think it's mainly because I just kind of want it to stop for awhile. They built up for ten years to their ~big finale~ and then put out the next movie in the franchise two months later! Let it breathe, guys.

That being said, the handful of things I'm looking forward to ...


Shang-Chi (Feb. 2021) - I think this might be the thing I'm looking forward to most! From what vanishingly little I know about it so far, it looks super fun, and also refreshingly disconnected from most of the rest of the franchise and unlikely to be huge and bombastic, which I gotta tell you is mostly what I want at this point. Except then there's also ...

Doctor Strange 2 (May 2021) - I didn't actually realize I was looking forward to this but apparently I am?! It may be terrible, but it will probably be entertaining and pretty. MULTIVERSE!

Thor 4: Love and Thunder (Nov 2021) - Lady Thor! Moar Valkyrie! Taika Waititi is back to direct! I am THERE.

Unfortunately that's about it, as far as personal excitement is concerned. I may check out the Falcon & Winter Soldier and Scarlet Witch shows, I'm sort of tentatively curious about the Loki one but still too annoyed that it's pre-character-development 2012 Loki to really have feelings about it, and apparently there's also something called "What If?" that will involve a number of established characters and I really hope is what it sounds like, an Elseworlds kind of thing.

No dates yet for Black Panther 2 (which I'm looking forward to, and I think it's weird they're pushing it back for a bunch of new stuff given how well the first movie did) or GotG 3 (which I wish I was more excited about, but the Gamora thing killed most of my interest). And I still miss my Netflix shows.

What are you looking forward to? My normal spoilerphobe policy is on hold for this; feel free to talk about anything that's been revealed about the upcoming, unreleased shows/movies so far, since there isn't much yet.

Comments

[kore]

I'm surprised they pushed both the Black Panther and Captain Marvel sequels back so far, but then someone told me there's a certain amount of time between solo movies? IDK.

It was kind of funny to see Feige going on about "new beginnings" and in reality there's Falcon/Winter Soldier, WandaVision, Loki, Dr Strange, Hawkeye, Thor....they're really pushing the "moving on" theme hard I guess.

[sholio]

This is more than usual, though! At least I think so? I mean, it was only what, 3 years between most of the IM, Cap, and Thor movies. And GotG. And Spider-Man too, I think? I can see it for CM since it just came out this year, but they could easily have gone with BP in 2020 or 2021 if they wanted to. I think this is another situation where "too many characters" (or in this case, too many franchises - sub-franchises?) is starting to be an issue. In fact, to the extent that it might start to be an anchor dragging back the ability of the individual (sub)franchises to build up momentum. It's getting to where they're going to have 5 or 6 or 7 years before sequels come out and that's kind of a lot.

[kore]

In fact, to the extent that it might start to be an anchor dragging back the ability of the individual (sub)franchises to build up momentum

Oh yeah, definitely -- I really wasn't expecting anything re Captain Marvel since that just came out, but it was weird not to have anything about BP 2, since I think 2021 put it in that three-year range for sequels.

(also sorry to have overcommented and to be such a fucking Debbie Downer, I think I was having medz issues)

[sholio]

Don't worry about it; I'll let you know if I'd like to have it dialed back a bit and/or just say up front if I'm wanting to have an upbeat discussion. It helps that I pretty much agree with you. XD

But yeah, I was thinking about this some more and I think something that's becoming clear in the post-EG era is that Marvel doesn't really have a plan anymore. As much as it went off the rails at times, and as much as I think it would have been a good move to have opened the franchise wider to a less all-white-dudes-all-the-time team, the early MCU was really focused! They had a handful of main tentpole franchises, bringing out a new movie every 3 years or so in those, interspersed with the big team movies, all building up to a big apocalyptic finish against a threat had been seeded into the previous movies as far back as Cap 1.

Defenders had an overall plan too, even though it got interrupted halfway through *WEEPS* but the interweaving of all the different shows really worked because of that.

... now, though? What the heck are they even doing? Most of the new movies involve second-string comics characters or further installments in established franchises, more or less at random. There are no big crossover movies on the horizon, and no indication of who they want their new "tentpole" characters to be. (I mean, I had THOUGHT that Spider-Man and CM were going to be that, but there are no new Spider-Man or CM movies scheduled for the near future.) And there doesn't seem to be anything tying together the different parts of the franchise, the way there was with Avengers and the Infinity Stones in the first decade. There are new movies with characters I had no idea they were going to be focusing on (e.g. Strange) and none of them really seem to connect together in any particular way.

Some of it wasn't what I wanted, but I will give Marvel major props for pulling off a 10-year integrated superhero universe and making the whole thing feel tied together and (mostly, anyway) planned. Now, though, it's starting to just feel like cash grabs and "okay, hey, we have this other character over here, let's make a movie about them!" Like someone said downthread, it's frustrating that now is when they've started pulling out the diverse casting, the female characters and superheroes of color ... now that they've burned up a bunch of viewer goodwill on earlier movies and people are starting to get tired of superheroes and they don't even seem to have a plan anymore.

[kore]

Oh good, I hate harshing squee, or even just being a downer. A bunch of people I know are feeling meh or even down about this news, tho! It's disorienting.

There are no big crossover movies on the horizon, and no indication of who they want their new "tentpole" characters to be. (I mean, I had THOUGHT that Spider-Man and CM were going to be that, but there are no new Spider-Man or CM movies scheduled for the near future.)

Yeah, plus the way Carol was really built up in her solo movie, and then appeared for five minutes at the start of EG and five minutes at the end, mostly so she could rescue Tony and get stomped by Thanos, was very strange. Meanwhile, we had....Ant-Man! Because we had to have the outsider white male POV, idek. (No really, they were like "Scott's been out of it for five years, what a great way to introduce what's happened!" Argle.) I thought she would be key to defeating Thanos and then help start building SWORD in order to defend earth and....no? Wha.

Like someone said downthread, it's frustrating that now is when they've started pulling out the diverse casting, the female characters and superheroes of color ... now that they've burned up a bunch of viewer goodwill on earlier movies and people are starting to get tired of superheroes and they don't even seem to have a plan anymore.

SERIOUSLY, THAT. I'm like "Jane!Thor!" and "Maybe Wanda won't get screwed over!" and "Look at that Eternals cast!" and then I feel immediately wary because I don't want to get burned again. Maybe the F4 will be brought in via the multiverse and they'll be the new anchors in the post-Infinity Saga plot? ??

I do wonder if they might bring back the Defenders or some of them via Hulu after that waiting period is up. Charlie Cox and Jon Bernthal are both really eager to return from what I know, but Krysten Ritter and Mike Colter seem Done (who can blame them). Maybe we could get a Daughters of the Dragon teamup. Maybe.