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A few itemized thoughts on Dresden Files #11: Turn Coat
1. AAAAAA THOMAS AAAAAAAAAAAA
2. The skinwalker ... hmmmm. When I was reading the preview chapters online and got to the skinwalker reveal, given Butcher's tendency to come across kind of well-meaning but extremely heavy-handed with anything other than white characters and Western mythology, I remember thinking, "Ooh, this has massive potential fail written all over it..." It wasn't as bad as I had feared from its first appearance, which basically came off as "pseudo-Native American monster cribbed loosely from generotribal lore menaces heroes"; you did get the feeling that he'd done at least some research (as opposed to just hearing about the general concept and going, oh, skinwalker=cool) and thought about how it would fit into the overall magical picture of his world and how the skinwalker-ala-Dresden was derived from the Navajo concept. And I liked that Listens-To-Wind was ultimately the person who defeated it while Harry just got the shit kicked out of him, as usual. *g* Still, as much as I enjoyed the menace of the thing within the context of the book, I'm uncomfortable with the whole idea of taking the skinwalker and then doing that much of a non-traditional spin on it without the originating culture being involved in the story, if that makes any sense.
I could probably do a whole post on how Butcher handles the non-Western supernatural, actually. I was bothered in the first few books that it seemed like the only magic in the whole world was Western/fae magic, but once he started dealing with other parts of the world, it was -- well, ham-fisted and kind of discomfort-inducing, really. I'll give him big props for dealing with it at all, because as the series goes on he's basically dealing more and more with a whole world of different, mutually incompatible magical systems and mythologies, rather than just sticking to one small geographical circle, which would have been a lot easier. Some of what he's done, though, makes me twitchy, like trying to make all magic fit into the Western-style model of the first couple of books, or the way that characters from other cultures often come off as one-dimensional stereotypes, like Mai and Listens-to-Wind. (In the latter case, I like him and I think Butcher is trying, but let's face it, the guy is a big frikkin' stereotype when he shows up and though he's gained some depth later on, it doesn't change the fact that he's a wise old shaman from some generic, still-unspecified tribe somewhere or other.)
But then he throws in things like the fact that the Council being dominated by Western practitioners is a big sticking point with magic-users from other countries, which is actually a pretty cool way to take the accidental bias in your books and use it as a plot point. I get the idea that he started out world-building a universe that was very Western-centric and is increasingly trying to expand it to reflect other worldviews, and while he's stumbling a lot as he does it, it's really fascinating to watch him do it, and I do think he's getting quite a bit better at it as he goes along.
3. Molllllyyyyyyy! :D I really liked her when she was first introduced, long before she became a major recurring character, and I just keep loving her more and more. As well as just enjoying her as a character, I love her mentor/student relationship with Harry, and I love how she struggles with the gray areas of magic, and how the books make interesting points about personal responsibility and bravery through her. Actually, this has always been something that I really like about these books: the characters' ongoing struggle to be decent people and do the right thing in the face of temptation, ugliness and evil. It's a recurring theme throughout the series, and I like how we've seen different people handling it in various ways; Molly, contrasted with Harry, contrasted with Thomas (*wails*), and so forth.
4. All in all, I don't think I enjoyed this book as much as some of the others, in large part because the White Council and their politics really aren't as interesting to me as some of the other areas of Harry's universe. And the reveal on the Black Council plot really felt like an anti-climax after all that buildup. I didn't expect it at all (though in retrospect, I feel like I should have -- I was just too busy suspiciously eyeing all of the main Council members, which was probably the point) but after all of that, I felt like a few pages of fighting with a bureaucrat and the revelation that, wait, there's another traitor! (THE END) was kind of a let-down.
5. I adore Harry's incorrigible smart-assitude.
6. The scene where they took the bullet out of Mouse made me tear up. *snivels*
7. I do sometimes get tired of every woman in Harry's world being unbelievably gorgeous. Just sayin'.
8. Thomas. You know, I didn't really like him in the first book in which he appeared (was it 3? or 5? something like that). Vampires are a hard sell for me. But he won me over hook, line and sinker over the next few books, in large part because he was so adorably devoted to Harry (and vice versa). Now ... I don't know how to feel, really. I'm honestly not sure where they're taking this. One of the things I really love about this series is the uncertainty -- the characters grow, and change, and sometimes they die, and I really have no idea what the next book has in store (and we probably have to wait a year or so to find out!). The thing is, I think it's pretty obvious that Thomas is at least partly deluding himself right now, because Harry soul-gazed him back in the beginning (didn't he?) so Harry knows that there's more to Thomas than just the demon side of him. But he's the only one of the White Court that we've seen show more than the barest scraps of decency, plus everything that everyone keeps saying about vampires being unable to change, and ... I want to believe that Harry is right, rather than Thomas and the whole rest of the world being right, but I'm not sure where this is going. I don't expect easy answers, because this series doesn't really give them and that's one of the things I like about it, but I really hope there's some kind of rescue and/or redemption coming up in the next book. Preferably the sort that doesn't end with the redemptee proving it by dying heroically. I really want to know if Thomas's newly rediscovered evilness can withstand Harry needing his help, because I suspect the situation is going to come up. At least, one can hope it does...
I think that's all I got right now. I'm sure I'm forgetting things ... :D
2. The skinwalker ... hmmmm. When I was reading the preview chapters online and got to the skinwalker reveal, given Butcher's tendency to come across kind of well-meaning but extremely heavy-handed with anything other than white characters and Western mythology, I remember thinking, "Ooh, this has massive potential fail written all over it..." It wasn't as bad as I had feared from its first appearance, which basically came off as "pseudo-Native American monster cribbed loosely from generotribal lore menaces heroes"; you did get the feeling that he'd done at least some research (as opposed to just hearing about the general concept and going, oh, skinwalker=cool) and thought about how it would fit into the overall magical picture of his world and how the skinwalker-ala-Dresden was derived from the Navajo concept. And I liked that Listens-To-Wind was ultimately the person who defeated it while Harry just got the shit kicked out of him, as usual. *g* Still, as much as I enjoyed the menace of the thing within the context of the book, I'm uncomfortable with the whole idea of taking the skinwalker and then doing that much of a non-traditional spin on it without the originating culture being involved in the story, if that makes any sense.
I could probably do a whole post on how Butcher handles the non-Western supernatural, actually. I was bothered in the first few books that it seemed like the only magic in the whole world was Western/fae magic, but once he started dealing with other parts of the world, it was -- well, ham-fisted and kind of discomfort-inducing, really. I'll give him big props for dealing with it at all, because as the series goes on he's basically dealing more and more with a whole world of different, mutually incompatible magical systems and mythologies, rather than just sticking to one small geographical circle, which would have been a lot easier. Some of what he's done, though, makes me twitchy, like trying to make all magic fit into the Western-style model of the first couple of books, or the way that characters from other cultures often come off as one-dimensional stereotypes, like Mai and Listens-to-Wind. (In the latter case, I like him and I think Butcher is trying, but let's face it, the guy is a big frikkin' stereotype when he shows up and though he's gained some depth later on, it doesn't change the fact that he's a wise old shaman from some generic, still-unspecified tribe somewhere or other.)
But then he throws in things like the fact that the Council being dominated by Western practitioners is a big sticking point with magic-users from other countries, which is actually a pretty cool way to take the accidental bias in your books and use it as a plot point. I get the idea that he started out world-building a universe that was very Western-centric and is increasingly trying to expand it to reflect other worldviews, and while he's stumbling a lot as he does it, it's really fascinating to watch him do it, and I do think he's getting quite a bit better at it as he goes along.
3. Molllllyyyyyyy! :D I really liked her when she was first introduced, long before she became a major recurring character, and I just keep loving her more and more. As well as just enjoying her as a character, I love her mentor/student relationship with Harry, and I love how she struggles with the gray areas of magic, and how the books make interesting points about personal responsibility and bravery through her. Actually, this has always been something that I really like about these books: the characters' ongoing struggle to be decent people and do the right thing in the face of temptation, ugliness and evil. It's a recurring theme throughout the series, and I like how we've seen different people handling it in various ways; Molly, contrasted with Harry, contrasted with Thomas (*wails*), and so forth.
4. All in all, I don't think I enjoyed this book as much as some of the others, in large part because the White Council and their politics really aren't as interesting to me as some of the other areas of Harry's universe. And the reveal on the Black Council plot really felt like an anti-climax after all that buildup. I didn't expect it at all (though in retrospect, I feel like I should have -- I was just too busy suspiciously eyeing all of the main Council members, which was probably the point) but after all of that, I felt like a few pages of fighting with a bureaucrat and the revelation that, wait, there's another traitor! (THE END) was kind of a let-down.
5. I adore Harry's incorrigible smart-assitude.
6. The scene where they took the bullet out of Mouse made me tear up. *snivels*
7. I do sometimes get tired of every woman in Harry's world being unbelievably gorgeous. Just sayin'.
8. Thomas. You know, I didn't really like him in the first book in which he appeared (was it 3? or 5? something like that). Vampires are a hard sell for me. But he won me over hook, line and sinker over the next few books, in large part because he was so adorably devoted to Harry (and vice versa). Now ... I don't know how to feel, really. I'm honestly not sure where they're taking this. One of the things I really love about this series is the uncertainty -- the characters grow, and change, and sometimes they die, and I really have no idea what the next book has in store (and we probably have to wait a year or so to find out!). The thing is, I think it's pretty obvious that Thomas is at least partly deluding himself right now, because Harry soul-gazed him back in the beginning (didn't he?) so Harry knows that there's more to Thomas than just the demon side of him. But he's the only one of the White Court that we've seen show more than the barest scraps of decency, plus everything that everyone keeps saying about vampires being unable to change, and ... I want to believe that Harry is right, rather than Thomas and the whole rest of the world being right, but I'm not sure where this is going. I don't expect easy answers, because this series doesn't really give them and that's one of the things I like about it, but I really hope there's some kind of rescue and/or redemption coming up in the next book. Preferably the sort that doesn't end with the redemptee proving it by dying heroically. I really want to know if Thomas's newly rediscovered evilness can withstand Harry needing his help, because I suspect the situation is going to come up. At least, one can hope it does...
I think that's all I got right now. I'm sure I'm forgetting things ... :D
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That really did score a few points with me, because that was bugging me over the past...most of the series? Ish?
And Thomas and Molly are two of my favorites, I just love how they're not devils and they're definitely not saints, and you never quite know what they're going to do next. Although for some reason, I get the feeling that Thomas will be killed soon (by dying heroically, of course) and I reeeeally don't want that. The whole Morgan thing was bad enough; he's not a favorite character or anything, but I liked the concept of him, if that makes sense.
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I kinda get the same feeling about Thomas that you do, though I'm not sure what's giving me that idea, but it seems like a logical projection of Thomas's general character arc. I really hope that's not where it's going, though, because I love having him around -- his ambiguity, his relationship with Harry, and the general story potential that he represents.
I can't figure out why I don't feel more about Morgan's death than I do. I guess it's just that he's been kind of a non-entity for the last few books; I think you make perfect sense that he's not really all that appealing as a person, but his role in Harry's life was an interesting one. Except he kinda vanished off the radar, and he hasn't had all that much to do lately, and after some really interesting development near the beginning, the character doesn't seem to be going anywhere anymore -- this book felt like it wrapped up his story in a way that I wasn't displeased with. I regret losing him but I'm not really upset about it -- I think I'm more upset (well, "upset" isn't the right word -- emotionally tangled up?) about what happened to Thomas.
I'm very curious what the next book is going to use as its major plotline. The last few have wrapped up a lot of the dangling loose ends, or at least moved them to a less urgent level, and based on the way that the books mix up the different major story threads, I don't think there would be two Council-centered books in a row. But I can't think of any other major storylines that are hanging out there right now besides the Black Council. We just had a book dealing with the divine swords and the faery courts. The only thing I can think of that hasn't been dealt with lately in a major way is Harry's past, which seems like a logical choice for the next book considering the Thomas situation. Of course, that would probably mean an Elaine-heavy book, and I am not fond of her...
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Of course, I'd just be happy to see Kincaid again. And Marcone. I missed them a bit in this one.
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I just went and skimmed that book to refresh my memory, and wow, Harry is so much more well-adjusted now than he was then! It's happened so gradually that, while I was aware of at least some of it while it was happening, it's really striking to go back and read one of the early books with the latest one fresh in my head. He's so much more centered and confident now; he's much more grounded, with a circle of people (and pets) who care about him and vice versa.
Damn it, they have to get Thomas back somehow! It can't stay this way!
And, yeah, ditto on Kincaid (I'm kinda lukewarm on Marcone, though I like him in small doses). Actually, I hope that next book is heavy on the human-normal characters; Murphy kinda got the short end of the stick in this book, and it would be lovely to see Murphy, Kinkaid and the other less powerful characters get to do a lot in the next book.
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And Harry really is more centered now, more aware of himself and the people around him. It probably has a lot to do with Molly, and being a teacher, being responsible for her life in a very real sense. It's good for him, I think.
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That sounds..vaguely interesting. Is this a show or a book or what? *looking for something to watch*
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If you like fantasy/urban fantasy/mystery, I do recommend them; they have a very rich and complicated world with lots of characters.
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And I really want to know what the "original purpose" of that island was, and how Harry figures into it -- it seems like a natural stepping off point for the next book. Or there's that other favor Harry owes Mab . . .
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I'm curious about the island, too, though it strikes me more as one of those apparently minor mysteries that's going to be pushed to the back burner for a while and then turn up again as a major plot point a few books down the road. (My god, how does Butcher keep track of all this stuff?! His notes file must be huge.)
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I didn't really like Thomas in the beginning, but he grew on me hugely, to the point where he's one of my favorites now.
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So, in my mind, the lack of other magical traditions seemed a natural thing. There isn't much to the Dresden magic mythology, and we're always seeing it with Harry, who doesn't get around much. Reminded me of the sort of magic from Harry Potter, where you get spells like Expelliarmus and Avada Kedavra.
Injun Joe always bugged me, because I had no idea what they were doing with that, and we never saw anything of Ancient Mai beyond 'she's asian, and she's a badass council member'.
In the end, I think it has very little in the way of race issues, comparatively for the genre. That's why the skinwalker didn't bug me. Butcher isn't writing a series in which the legends of skinwalkers would matter one whit.
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And you've got a point that the problems are sort of endemic to the genre in general. Butcher probably has fewer issues than a lot of urban fantasy authors (which isn't to say *none*).
I did, however, enjoy the book!
having finally finished the book...
#2: I'm hoping that since Listens-to-Wind will apparently be showing up more often in the future to teach Harry, he'll become something less of a stereotype? Maybe?
#4: I pretty much picked Peabody out for the villain the second he showed up (he was the only new character! and perfectly positioned for a betrayal!), which was kind of sad-- one of the main joys I get out of this series is not having any clue what Dresden is going to pull next. But I didn't see the thing with the detective guy coming, so that made up for it. And I'm glad to see Dresden continuing to be willing to use more mundane methods to get things done.
#5: heck, yes.
#7: heck, yes.
just finished it
I am hoping that Jim Butcher is sibling-focused (what with his sisters and all) such that he won't actually kill Thomas off...but that means his redemption will probably take a few books to happen....
(My hope/prediction is that Harry will stick by Thomas through some quite dark stuff, because of the family connection, and finally pull him through...so when Harry goes darkside - because it's got to happen sooner or later, right? - Thomas will be around to return the favor...)
I do sometimes get tired of every woman in Harry's world being unbelievably gorgeous. Just sayin'.
I actually read some of this as narrator bias - Harry tends to think most women are beautiful. It's not that they all look like supermodels, except in Harry's eyes, which is kind of sweet.
(I tend to take the Western-centrism the same way; Harry's world is very much white-guy American world because Harry himself is - and Butcher, too, obviously; but that's the advantage of making your narrator like yourself. And Butcher is trying, and Harry is learning...the books aren't models of cultural sensitivity, but as far as the genre goes, they're not bad...)
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I caught it the second we saw Peabody twice inside of 10 pages. :) Something just went 'click' with, "Oh, who else has access to all information, but no one ever thinks of him as a Power?" and I knew it had to be the secretary. For the rest of the book, I was just waiting for everyone else to catch up.
7. I do sometimes get tired of every woman in Harry's world being unbelievably gorgeous. Just sayin'.
Hmmm... if we're going by this book, mostly the women who are being described are associated with the White Court, where beauty is required. Luccio's body was originally snatched for the precise reason that it was beautiful. Murphy is usually described as 'cute' (except she'd kill you for using the term). And I'd call the descriptions of Molly and Charity more "valkyrie sexy" than beautiful, and the same for Georgia. So it's never something that's really bothered me.
And also, I agree with
And Thomas. < sigh > I love Thomas and Harry's relationship to pieces, and I hurt for Harry losing that. :(
For the rest... no, Butcher isn't perfect, but he's trying and he is getting better, which I believe in giving props for. In fact, he gets cookies. :)