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Leverage. Hmm.
I hate to break with my f'list here, but ... I'm not really feeling the love. We watched the first two episodes tonight and so far I'm not overly impressed. Character-wise, I love Hardison and Parker, and I like Elliot okay (as a source of entertainment, anyway, not really as a person), and there's some fun banter, but this is offset by feeling massively emotionally manipulated by the whole show. I just feel like it's deliberately and obviously tweaking at the heartstrings, holding a flashing sign over the characters' heads reading These Are People You Will Like. You Will Like Them. and bending over backwards to prove that they aren't really bad guys, they're people who steal money from evil corporations to cause massive tax problems for help disabled veterans!
I think I'd like the show a lot better if the characters would just revel in their lawbreaking ways rather than trying to convince the audience that they're not that bad after all. Butch and Sundance didn't steal money to give to hospitals! They stole it because they were self-indulgent thrill-seekers and they liked it that way! As it is, I feel like the show's trying to do some moral sleight of hand ("They're stealing from corporations and smugglers! It's not really stealing!") that's not quite working. The whole disabled-veterans thing was so over-the-top I couldn't believe they actually went there. Why not just go all the way and use handicapped orphans, guys? (Maybe they're saving that one for a future episode...) I'm having trouble articulating this -- I just feel like the show is stuck in some kind of weird limbo between having its characters be bastards gleefully revelling in their bastardness, and having them be selfless heroes, and it seems like its efforts to sell us on the idea that they're really selfless heroes while showing their bastardness makes it seem like a thin rationalization and makes me like them less, not more.
There's a certain amount of distance to most heist movies; you know that what the characters are doing is wrong, so there's a gleeful kind of self-indulgence to suspending your awareness of the consequences and going along for the ride. I feel like the show is trying too hard to sell us on the idea that what the characters are doing is right, which just makes me feel sort of awkward and, like I said, a bit manipulated.
I certainly didn't hate it. I like some of the characters, and there are a lot of neat/fun moments to offset the moments when I eyeroll at the screen, but I'm not really sure if it's worth sticking it out for another episode or two. I feel vaguely guilty because a lot of my f'list seems to love this show; I just can't seem to get into it.
I think I'd like the show a lot better if the characters would just revel in their lawbreaking ways rather than trying to convince the audience that they're not that bad after all. Butch and Sundance didn't steal money to give to hospitals! They stole it because they were self-indulgent thrill-seekers and they liked it that way! As it is, I feel like the show's trying to do some moral sleight of hand ("They're stealing from corporations and smugglers! It's not really stealing!") that's not quite working. The whole disabled-veterans thing was so over-the-top I couldn't believe they actually went there. Why not just go all the way and use handicapped orphans, guys? (Maybe they're saving that one for a future episode...) I'm having trouble articulating this -- I just feel like the show is stuck in some kind of weird limbo between having its characters be bastards gleefully revelling in their bastardness, and having them be selfless heroes, and it seems like its efforts to sell us on the idea that they're really selfless heroes while showing their bastardness makes it seem like a thin rationalization and makes me like them less, not more.
There's a certain amount of distance to most heist movies; you know that what the characters are doing is wrong, so there's a gleeful kind of self-indulgence to suspending your awareness of the consequences and going along for the ride. I feel like the show is trying too hard to sell us on the idea that what the characters are doing is right, which just makes me feel sort of awkward and, like I said, a bit manipulated.
I certainly didn't hate it. I like some of the characters, and there are a lot of neat/fun moments to offset the moments when I eyeroll at the screen, but I'm not really sure if it's worth sticking it out for another episode or two. I feel vaguely guilty because a lot of my f'list seems to love this show; I just can't seem to get into it.
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It's on it's fifth season right now. (And they're UK seasons, so sadly very short - but at least it means no great commitment in checking it out!)
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I don't want to spoil Hustle for you, but - they all have fun, and I absolutely love the whole crew, even though I acknowledge that they can all be horrible, horrible people. *g* (Usually, though, they're much much better about going after people that makes you go \o/ when they own them at the end.) Plus, Hustle pokes holes in the fourth wall to flirt with the audience. Sometimes by doing a dance routine. How could you resist that?
On top of everything else, the Hustle crew feels like family in a way I'm really not getting from Leverage (yet?).
In Leverage, like you, I find Parker and Hardison to be quite fantastic. They're fun and unusual characters - I haven't seen anyone quite like them in anything else! So that scores huge points with me. And Elliot is the world's most dangerous puppy. ♥ Overall, though, Leverage has yet to win me over, and I've seen all episodes but the season finale. I would go into why, but that would entail spoilers, so I won't.
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I'm pretty sure that's intentional--the group dynamic is supposed to be fragile. It wouldn't work for me if these five loners became a real family after so little time.
The other thing that is important to remember is that the episode order as aired on TNT is very, very different from the intended order. I understand why TNT did it that way from the point of view of attracting an audience, but the problem is that it scrambled the character arcs rather badly.
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I'm going to keep watching Leverage, though, because The First David Job pulled me back in after some of the previous episodes almost lost me (keeping this spoiler free for
But Hustle - right now it just makes me happy to have a show where most of the characters have known each other for a long time, and trust each other and help each other out and are all around adorable together.
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And without spoilers, I'll just say, as someone who never cries at TV shows, that there was definitely something in my eye while I was watching "The Second David Job".
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Ah, I'm very much looking forward to watching "The Second David Job"! TV watching is a group activity for me, and we haven't yet have a chance to gather the whole Leverage-watching crew for a session in a whole, so... that's something to look forward to. ♥
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One of the things I like most about Parker is that she's not the straight (wo)man for the boys; she's just as crazy as they are (if not more so)! :D And people told me that Hardison was awesome, and they were right.
Overall, though, the show is just falling flat for me -- it's hard to articulate the reasons exactly, but I do think a lot of it is that I feel like they're trying to sanitize it too much, as if they feel like they have to justify the team's activities rather than just having them do it 'cause they like it and are addicted to the thrill of adrenaline. I don't really like the two main leads, and I'm finding it hard to suspend enough disbelief to go along for the rides on the plots.
Like I said to
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Hustle is fun~! You should give it a go! It's short enough (6 eps/season!) that it's not going to be more than a fun fling either way. Plus, it has everything you were wishing Leverage had, so it sounds like it'd be a perfect match for you. ♥
That Parker is allowed to be batshit even though she's a girl is one of the things that makes me go \o/! She can out-weird everyone else on her team! And Hardison is just interesting and fun and gets the best lines.
Alas, I can't say I'm very charmed by the two leads, either, and... that is a bit of a problem. ^^;; But maybe if you come back to it later, you'll like it better! It might also perk up in its second season - after all, first seasons deserve a break, I think.
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I think I'll give it a break and then try it again ... a lot of my f'list does like it, and two episodes is hardly giving it a fair shot!
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I honestly don't mind the heartstring-tugging, especially not with eps like "The Homecoming Job" that are very thinly-veiled takes on real-life events. I've watched that episode multiple times, and each time I get a visceral thrill out of seeing
BlackwaterCastleman brought down. There are few entities I loathe more than insurance companies, so the idea that Nate's doing what he does because the company he worked for screwed him is easy for me to buy because they're doing something I wish I could do.It doesn't hurt that the Alec/Eliot was obvious to me in the first ten minutes, and that the EP is quite clear when he's throwing in the fanservice that he knows about the slash and it doesn't bother him.
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I do adore Hardison for not being a stereotype and for just being, well, him (snarky nerd-boys, my fan candy!) -- and I like that Parker, too, is played against type for the sort of character that she is, at least so far; I had a moment's flinch when she came onscreen as the sexy cat burglar, but I love her defiant thrill-seeking and the fact that she's not the straight man for the boys -- something that you don't see very often with women in ensemble casts on TV, where usually the boys are the crazy ones and the girls get to play "mom". (I liked Vala for similar reasons.)
Since it's not really grabbing me, I'm tempted to give it a rest for a bit and come back to it later. I do think it's got the potential to grow on me, but it's just not really what I want to watch right now; this might be a good one for when I get to hiatus breaks and/or ends-of-seasons on the other shows I'm currently catching up on.
Thank you very much for the episode listing, though; I'll go renumber 'em on my hard drive so that I have them all ready to go when I'm ready to watch the rest. :D
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Also, thanks for the proper episode-order - the show would've worked better that way, definitely.
ETA - You're probably tiring of the "yay Hustle!" comments, and I swear, I'm not trying to convince you to change allegiances or anything - but if you haven't seen any of the show, as far as CoC go, Hustle's leading man is the marvelous Mickey "Bricks" Stone, played by the gorgeous Adrian Lester (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0504412/).
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One other thing:
1.) The Nigerian Job
2.) The Homecoming Job
3.) The Wedding Job
4.) The Snow Job
5.) The Mile High Job
6.) The Miracle Job
7.) The Two Horse Job
8.) The Bank Shot Job
9.) The Stork Job
10.) The Juror #6 Job
11.) The 12 Step Job
12.) The First David Job
13.) The Second David Job
Re: One other thing:
One thing I forgot to put in my above comment is that I'm a total non-shipper and even I can see strong vibes on both Alec/Elliot and Alec/Parker. I don't know if they're playing it that way on purpose, or if the actors just have that much chemistry.
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Hardison, Parker, and Elliot are worth watching the show for, but yeah - "trying too hard" is how I felt for a lot of it.
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Having said that, I do like some of the characters and I have most of the series already downloaded, so I will probably watch a few more episodes just to give it a fair shot. I'll probably watch more Scrubs first, though...
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The CEOs of Leverage are like the corporate bad guys of Captain Planet - they're supervillains, rubbing their hands together while giggling gleefully at how they're screwing over innocent people. It's not that I think corporations are good - and megacorp CEOs, well, I'm a believer in Lord Acton, "power tends to corrupt". But Leverage is so cartoonish about it. A real CEO can't just go around telling people they're being evil for the hell of it, they have to couch their greed in acceptable terms - even in their own minds, a lot of times; that's what's insidious about it. By presenting fictional villains that are so unbelievable, it's almost like Leverage is letting the real-life bad guys off the hook...
Yes, watch more of Scrubs! There's so much cute and funniness to come!
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That's not rhetorical -- just wondering if it's the trope in general you dislike or if there's something about Leverage that makes it different from the Robin Hood thing, which is what I always thought they were doing with the show. Not, "we want them to be bastards, but we want people to like them, so let's make them bastards for Good!" but "how about a modern-day Robin Hood with thieves who use their mad-hot thievery skillz to help the poor and downtrodden?"
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If you haven't read the series, I'm not necessarily recommending it, btw; it's about a pretty unredeemed criminal who thinks himself vaguely feminist in a far-future society ... as written in, like, the 50s. In other words, sexism ahoy! I only bring it up because it sounded similar to what you mention. That character does revel in his schemes, though.
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It's not just me!
My flist is going nuts about it and....meh.
(but, well, between Sanctuary and my new complete infatuation with The Sarah Connor Chronicles I don't really need another show)
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I think part of the problem is that I'm kind of full-up with mediocre shows that are mostly entertaining because of their cute cast ... pretty much everything I'm watching right now (SPN, NCIS, and of course the Stargates) are like that, and while I do enjoy fanning on shows like that, I think I'm more craving something that's a little bit stronger.
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*nods*
I keep thinking I should give it another try, since I really was jet-lagged and falling asleep the one episode I watched, but it just doesn't sound appealing, however much EVERYONE on my flist is squeeing.
I'm kind of full-up with mediocre shows that are mostly entertaining because of their cute cast ... pretty much everything I'm watching right now (SPN, NCIS, and of course the Stargates) are like that, and while I do enjoy fanning on shows like that, I think I'm more craving something that's a little bit stronger.
That makes sense. I was kinda completely out of shows - the only current ones I was watching were the 'gates, since I forgot to keep watching SPN and I still haven't remembered to watch most of SGA S5. Sanctuary has been a lot of fun though the writing isn't what it could be (I just...Damian Kindler has a lot of strengths, but also a lot of weaknesses. I'd like to see him have help from someone who is good at writing tighter plots).
But did you ever try Sarah Connor Chronicles? I finally poked at it last week after meaning to for a long time and I haven't felt this blown away in a long time. Real, solid, dimensional characters who grow and change and have secrets and aren't always predictable. Solid writing and plotting and just...I can't stop watching it. Plus, chicks kicking ass doesn't hurt anything :)
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But I get that you might want something more, something more intellectually stimulating. I don't think that exists on TV at the moment. The comedies are generally the most intelligent things on TV ("Scrubs", "The Office", "30 Rock"...even the new show, "Better Off Ted", looks like its going to be of that class). But the dramas are mostly meh. I watch "Lie to Me" mostly for Tim Roth, but it doesn't grab me. I also like the characters on "Life", but the story lines aren't great. There are just too many police procedurals on TV right now. Whatever happened to the old, awesome PI shows?
I can't help but love the characters on Leverage, though. I love it the way I like Reaper, Chuck, Psych, and Monk. They just make me happy. But, yeah, I'd never fan it. There's nothing yet to make me want to fan it.
(Oh, as for the "evil corporation" trope. I work for one of them, so I thought it would bother me as well, but they went away from that pretty quickly, and just went after greedy individuals for most of the season).
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I'm glad to hear they tone down the 'evil corporation' thing; the black-and-white plotlines are one of the things that's bothering me about the show, and if they ease up on it a bit, I might like the show more.
And I need to get caught up on Psych! That's such a fun show. :D I do wish for a little more angst sometimes; that's one thing I really love about Scrubs, actually -- it's cute and fluffy, but then it'll take a 90-degree turn and yank your heartstrings! I love shows that can do that to me. Psych often leaves me craving a bit more than it gives me... but mostly because I adore the characters so much that I want to see their relationships tested in a way that the show just doesn't do.
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