sholio | Oh, and FYI ...

Oh, and FYI ...

EDIT: This entry originally said "Don't worry about spoilers anymore, because I think I already know everything anyway". I ... kinda decided to take that back, because now I'm worried that there may be more out there that I don't know -- since I haven't been reading the episode spoilers on GW and there *are* still unaired episodes of both series out there. I'm not gonna boot anyone for accidentally mentioning something, but I would still prefer it if we at least made an effort to keep spoilers beyond the current ep airing in Canada out of the discussions.

I realize it's the Internet and spoilers are, to some extent, unavoidable, so I'm not gonna freak if I do find out something. I think it's more like, I'm just not really gonna think about it too much.

[Note: This post, and comments, do contain spoilers for Sunday and more]

I maintain that I am excited to find out what the writing crew are going to do with our lovely cast in the rest of Season 3 and in Season 4 and beyond.

I love this show, I think its cast and crew are truly awesome, and I'm glad that they aren't afraid to pull a "Joss" and make unpopular decisions sometimes. I hated some of the things that Joss Whedon did on Buffy, and DON'T get me started on a certain character death in a certain other Whedon show. But overall? I'm honestly very glad that he wasn't afraid to make his characters, his cast, his world, grow and change. I didn't agree with everything he did to it, but I'm infinitely glad that Season 7 of Buffy wasn't exactly the same as Season 1, with the same cast and Buffy and her friends still in high school.

On SGA, there were a lot of changes at the end of Season 1. S2 & S3 have been very similar to one another (except for the stronger focus on character interaction in S3 -- YAYs) and now there has been another shakeup, and I, for one, am excited to see what the future's going to bring. As with that certain Joss spoiler, I think that this could have been handled differently, in a way I would have rather seen. But I'm not writing the show. I'll live. And I wanna know what's gonna happen next.

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I'm with you in being excited about season 4, even if I'm still feeling the ramifications in Sunday. I hope nothing I posted in my journal wound up contributing to your spoiling because I've tried to keep things only in the posts that were marked.

I know there's a lot of cries over the news going around, but like I told someone else, I vented long ago on my fears and now I'm actually intrigued by comments that are coming out of the camp about season 4.

I do like the sound of a 'new direction' because one thing that I have noticed and have been a little frustrated by, is that there are a fair amount of similar plots to episodes already done in SG-1. I know there will always be similarities but there's been enough that are just too much like what's been done before.

They really need to get some fresh angles and do some new things.

I think it was your post I finally clicked on (after resisting Atlantis_fan's) and then promptly went over to Gateworld and read, and read, and read!

Yeah, I don't think I mind knowing the big changes. I had no idea that Daniel was going to die in SG-1, and now would prefer to know about that kind of change - that it's coming - that's all. Details, plots and character moments, these I don't want spoiled.

And yes, after an initial 'NO! They're doing WHAT?!' that no one else was privvy to, I've calmed down and choose to see the glass as half full.

I would, however, like to know just how involved AT is going to be. It still seems to me that with two SG-1 films, one of which starts shooting on April 15th that she's not going to be a huge imposition. It's just not practical. But I could be wrong - and freely acknowledge that it is speculation on my part.

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NO NO!!! In Meridian season 4.

NO! I know NADA about SG-1 s10

I know! I know! SORRY! I'm a total idiot! The keyboard-brain disconnect is even worst than usual this morning!

I realized after posting that comment what you had meant.

Okay, I'm a total IDIOT. I'm half asleep here and I just deleted the comment I just posted, because I didn't read your post in depth and I just realized that I completely, utterly misinterpreted something that you said. Please forgive my last comment. I, er -- I'm a total idiot, what can I say. I'm sorry!

No worries, but you gave me a SHOCK there! I was all NOOOOO!!! I'm talking about season 5 (not 4 duh!) MERIDIAN!!!

I couldn't reply fast enough!!

Will delete these when you see them. Honestly - I know nothing about SG-1 beyond 10x11, aprt from April 15th is when they start shooting the films.

Honey, I would NEVER do something like that. NEVER NEVER NEVER!!!!

*Hysterical laughter of relief*

*laughs* No, you don't have to delete 'em... I'm just a total idiot this morning, is all. Time got away from me last night because I got sucked into writing an episode reaction and then discussing it online -- then I had to get up when hubby got up, meaning I've only had 3 hours of sleep. I might go back to bed actually ...

I do feel rather dense.

Well I guessed you hadn't got much sleep, looking at what time you stayed up posting stuff. No worries AT ALL!

It's my own darned fault, though! No one to blame but myself.

No, it wasn't you. I found out a big one within the last few days from an uncut post in someone's LJ (that I no longer read because of that) and I *am* actually more intrigued that worried by the rumors I've been hearing about season 4.

I hope it wasn't my LJ that you were referring to-if so, I deeply apologize! :-( I'm so new with my LJ, and just reacted when I read some news, and since it was only my third post and I wasn't expecting anyone to be visiting yet, it didn't occur to me 'til later to put in spoiler cuts. I went back the next day and put everything behind cuts, but if it was indeed me that you were talking about, I am so very sorry. If it wasn't-whew! There's not very many people that even know of the existance of my LJ yet (there's nothing there to see), but since I did send you a message asking about friending, I thought there was a chance it was me, and I apologize. If it wasn't, awesome...moving right along...I was never here.....

No, no, don't worry, really don't worry. It wasn't you!

Thanks! ...sigh of relief...

I take change in stride because I was a Buffy and Angel fan. Glad you mentioned them. Frankly I was excited about Ben Browder joining SG-1, something different. I like Jewel Stait so...come on down! I think there may be an underlying story reason for Tapping...who knows, it should be fun. Its a show and nothing will make me stop watching it unless it just loses my interest. Hey, it's only TV.

Yeah ... I'm really not opposed to change at all. I think actually, sad as it is, the fandom is doing more to make me lose interest in the show than anything that's actually happening *on* the show. Which probably means that it's getting to be time for me to pull out of the fandom for a while.

Yea, some of the fans are even giving me headaches! I'm not one who likes change, but I do like characters to grow and develop, so I'm looking forward to season 4. Though you will hear me scream if they do anything nasty to Sheppard or Mckay! :)

I've found a number of LJ's with sane fans, who have intelligent conversation (yours included!), who I enjoy seeing what they think and I'm going to keep up with that and try to ignore the fen who are freaking. :::sigh:::

Though you will hear me scream if they do anything nasty to Sheppard or Mckay!

*laughs* Yeah ... and that's the saddest thing because I really CAN sympathize with the reactions of some people, because I know that I'd be pretty incensed if they killed either of those two.

On the other hand, as with SG-1 breaking up the Jack-Daniel friendship (repeatedly) where it was my original reason for watching, I think I would still go on even in that case. At least, I *think* so.

I've had my panic attack, and now I'm curious about where they're going to go.

Can't say I'm excited exactly, but I'm hopeful at the least.

Another friend of mine has noted that Joss has always been willing to shake things up, while the Stargate PTB have always concentrated on keeping the status quo the same. They're different shows.

I wish they'd been able to give Ford more to do in Atlantis, but I can't deny I love the team with Ronon. And it seems unfair that they didn't do anything with Carson as a geneticist and the Wraith storylines (whom they were fighting) and with the entire Pegasus genome to work with, and then *poof*! All gone.

It is really incredibly sad that the storyline potential associated with Carson wasn't realized while it still could be. That's probably one of my two biggest regrets about this particular turn, aside from (obviously) Carson being gone -- that the storyline will probably be basically dropped, and also that I'm worried about the effect that losing one of their core members might have on the closeness between the group as a whole.

Another friend of mine has noted that Joss has always been willing to shake things up, while the Stargate PTB have always concentrated on keeping the status quo the same.

You know, while it's true that the feeling of the shows is different, I'm not sure if I agree with this. Joss generally changed things *more*, and more frequently and severely, but Stargate has made a number of major changes to their core cast over the years -- both 'Gates have killed or taken off several characters, and the SG-1 status quo is *incredibly* different now than it was in 1995, both in terms of where the Earth is in terms of technology and so forth, and as far as the characters' personal lives. Carson's death is a big change but not an unprecedented one.

I'm worried about the effect that losing one of their core members might have on the closeness between the group as a whole.

See, that would be an interesting thing to look back on and chart. Do things go on, 'same old, same old' with nary a reference? Or do they stumble and have to think about it? "Go see Carso--" *pause* "Go see the new doc."

I imagine this has got to be a difficult thing for the writers to deal with. I know this because I've dealt with killing characters in some of my (non-fanfic) stories. Now that they've made this decision to kill someone off, do they *want* to be continually reminding the viewers of it? I'm worried that they're going to simply ignore Carson's death for the most part, not to belittle Carson (which I'm sure is how the fans will take it) but simply because they don't want the fanbase to be continually reminded of the death.

I'm about to go off into a commentary on how the Western world does its level best to hide death, hide loss, and never deal with it.

*resists*

Yeah, I hope they don't completely ignore it - the fact that he's gone and, yeah, they miss him, would be a good place to start.

However, I fear that the show will go on to the tune of 'same old, same old'.

I quite agree with you, about the Western world's approach to death ... and I fully expect (based on past experience with SGA) that they're going to lean much too heavily in the "pretend everything's normal" direction.

You can certainly go too far the other way. One of the other shows that I watch killed off a character and then has spent half a season wallowing in angst over it. And while I'm glad that the fallout from the death is being dealt with, it's actually starting to affect my enjoyment of the show ... I want to see the characters deal with it and move on, not 10 episodes of them being depressed and angry.

A little moment here and there can go a long way.

*sighs*

But subtlety is not the hallmark of Stargate.

Perhaps the death would be easier to swallow if SGA had a history of taking risks with drastic changes to cast and characters as Whedon did. When I view a Whedon series, I know that he is more than willing to yank the rug out, as it were. SGA doesn't normally do that, so to have a character like Carson die? Well. Wow. Most viewers of the show wouldn't expect it and it would be a hard pill to swallow.

Still, I respect SGA for doing it (don't know how I'd feel if it had been Sheppard or McKay, though) and I am curious to see how season four plays out. Heck, I'm curious to see how the rest of season three plays out. I hope that at least the emotional fallout from "Sunday" makes an appearance in the coming episodes.

I hope that at least the emotional fallout from "Sunday" makes an appearance in the coming episodes.

This is the one thing that the SGA PTB are very bad at - following up on a major storylines. Take Trinity for example. This was supposed to be a major issue for McKay, but we got nothing in the way of fallout from it.

I certainly hope we have more of a follow-up on Carson's death - especially from Rodney since they so kindly told us that Rodney and Carson were BFFs. Since they never bothered in three years showing us that Carson and Rodney were so close, I guess we'll have to take their word for it.

Well, I think there's no doubt that Carson and Rodney have been portrayed as friends, and good ones at that. Prior to this episode, I had thought of Carson as Rodney's best friend in the early part of Season 1, being slowly supplanted by John in that role -- but there was no doubt in my mind that Carson was the person he was closest to after John. This episode just indicates that Carson never actually lost that "best friend" status in Rodney's mind that he'd had in the beginning.

Like you, though, I don't expect a whole lot of follow-up. And one reason is simply because I imagine TPTB are not going to be too eager to remind viewers of the death.

I'm really curious now as to what Rodney's reaction will be to the new doctor when she shows up. Will he be distant? Will he ignore her? Will it be business as usual? We need follow-up.

As while I agree that Rodney and Carson were good friends, it was the "closest thing to a best friend I've ever had" comment that doesn't sit well with me. But, of course, that may be my own prejudice because I consider John to be Rodney's best friend, and that has been shown to us.

*grin* Yeah ... I didn't react terribly well to that, either. "One of my best friends" ... "one of the best friends I've ever had" ... that would have sit a lot better with me (and, honestly, sounded like a more Rodney sort of thing to say). It's not JUST that I want to see John and Rodney as best friends (although I do); it's that I think the show has shown us that they are, which means that we've got one of those situations where canon is TELLING us one thing and SHOWING us the opposite.

Well, again, major cast changes are *not* unprecedented on a Stargate show. They're a lot more likely to do it than many shows are. But I know what you mean, that the death has more impact because it's rare.

Like you, I respect them for doing it. And I am curious to see what happens next.

Thanks so much for posting this and the last couple of post before it. I haven't seen the episode yet, so I can't comment on it yet, but I'm glad to read that there is someone out there who feels like I do. I'm trying to put the situation into perspective and this post helps. I'm very upset about what's happening to Carson. And having met Paul McGillion at a couple of conventions and knowing what a really nice guy he is, I feel really bad for him losing his job like that. However, I'm not one of those people who say they are going to quit watching the show over this. Like you, I'm willing to see where they go with things next season. It's good to know that I'm not the only because on some of the lists and boards I've been reading, it seemed like I was the only one.

I mean, a couple of nights ago I read some stuff online right before I went to bed. That was a mistake. I was so upset about it that I actually had trouble sleeping. I had to get up to go to work after only getting a few hours of sleep. D'oh! To state the obvious, that's not good. It's just a tv show. A tv show I love, my favorite as a matter of fact, but still just a tv show. Losing sleep over it is just stupid.

And as for Paul McGillion, I think he's a terrific actor. I doubt he'll stay out of a job for long.

It's just a tv show. A tv show I love, my favorite as a matter of fact, but still just a tv show. Losing sleep over it is just stupid.

Oh, THANK you for saying this. I've been occasionally reminding myself of this fact, too. My life does not revolve around this show, and getting upset enough over a fictional character's death that it carries over into other areas of my life is just silly. Heck, if anything, maybe this will actually help bring a better balance to my life, because I *have* been getting very deep in fandom lately, and I *do* have other interests that have been somewhat neglected.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to pull out of the fandom! I'll still be commenting; I'll still be reading and writing fanfic. But I think this may help me put the show in perspective to my life as a whole, because it really *was* taking over an excessively large corner of it.

I feel bad for Paul too, especially since from the sound of things, the cast of the show are all so close in real life as well. Actually my big worry when I first heard about this was not that it'd mess up the dynamic *on* the show, but that it would mess with the dynamic *off* the show ... thus spilling over into the way the actors relate to each other in their character roles. However, this *is* simply part of being an actor, having to deal with changes in your character and storylines. And as you said, he's a fantastic actor and I do hope that he surfaces somewhere else pretty quickly.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to pull out of the fandom! I'll still be commenting; I'll still be reading and writing fanfic.

Glad to hear this. I love your fic. I would love to write fic. Unfortunately, my writing skills leave a lot to be desired. I used to try and write fic, but I've reecently come to the conclusion that I'm a lot better at reading. Fortunately for me, there are some really good fic authors in the SGA fandom, you included.

Thank you!

Yeah ... I'm certainly not leaving. But I'm starting to think the level of fannishness I've experienced over the last year is getting a wee bit detrimental to my life as a whole (judging by the fact that I got about 3 hours of sleep on Tuesday because I was so thoroughly sucked into the Sunday discussions). I need to get back to fanning on the side and actually LIVING, rather than living on the side with fanning as my focus ...

I'm so with you on all these points. I'm excited for season 4. Excited to see how the changes are handled and what all-around direction the show will go in. I love the show and its characters and actors and directors and I can't wait to see what happens next in every aspect of the series. Well said :)

*grin* Thanks!

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Oh, and FYI ...

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