sholio: sun on winter trees (SPN-dean gun)
Sholio ([personal profile] sholio) wrote2007-01-13 09:08 pm

Supernatural 2x10

Oh, DEAN.

Especially after the last couple of episodes, I was halfway expecting this show to take the "Lost" tack and cut away before actually telling us anything. I'm really, really glad that they didn't -- and, in fact, I feel like things have actually progressed a little bit. The last few episodes were enjoyable but I was starting to feel a sense that we were ... well, spinning our wheels as far as the overall development of the plot. This gave it a little nudge back on track.

And suddenly Dean's angst this season is so much clearer. I mean, while I really felt for the guy, there have been times when there was also a temptation to smack him a bit and tell him to get over himself and get back to the business of living.

But this ... this ... It's just that things make so much more sense now, because not only has he been carrying this massive load of guilt, but he's also got this giant burden of fear for Sam, and maybe a little bit of fear of Sam too. He's lost his father and it's not only possible, but likely that he's going to lose Sam too. (I mean, from Dean's perspective. Not so much from our perspective.)

And was it just me, but were things a little lighter between them at the end of the episode than they have been in a while? Even though Sam's initial reaction was ... well, let's face it, everything Dean was afraid of, it seems like when it was all over that it actually did make it easier for them to relate to each other. I'm still not absolutely certain that what Dean told Sam was EVERYTHING that his father had told him, but it had to have been a large part of what he's been carrying by himself for these months. And it seemed like the way they were verbally bouncing off each other at the end, with the teasing and the grinning, was a lot more like they used to be than they have been since John died.
ext_3572: (Default)

[identity profile] xparrot.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 06:39 am (UTC)(link)
Ahhh, I loved the byplay at the end. I am absolutely loving Sam this season, the way they've done a complete role reversal. Now Sam's the one determined to keep with the hunt no matter what, and the one who's holding it together, who can afford to joke about his brother killing him because he trusts his brother that much. And oh, oh, oh, Dean...I had figured it was something of the sort, what John had said (I think Dean did confess all myself, though I can't be certain. And there's still his secret in Bloody Mary that hasn't yet been revealed...) but it does make Dean's craziness this season make sense. Such a very heavy burden to carry...
ext_1981: (Wiseguy-Vinnie Frank hug)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 06:55 am (UTC)(link)
The role reversal is interesting, isn't it? It seems as if both brothers have really been having to examine their personal roles both in the family, and in life. And in Dean's case, this has led him to realize that not only is hunting NOT the be-all and end-all of existence for him, but it's very far from it. I really don't think that he had thought it through in that much depth until just recently; I get the impression that it was the role that had been chosen for him by his father, and he didn't question it. Now he *is* questioning it because he's being forced to choose between that and Sam.

*laughs* And you know, this is exactly what I had mentioned way back at the beginning of the first season, that Dean might someday have to choose between his moral code and his brother. Only, first off I didn't think they'd actually DO it ... and, back then, with my much more one-sided view of Dean at the time, I really thought that he'd end up in a VERY different place if he ever did have to make a choice like that.

I *hope* that Dean is being entirely straight with Sam, for his sake. It's possible that just keeping the secret was part of what was making him so miserable, because Dean's not at all a deceptive guy -- at least I don't think he is; he's a straight-shooter by nature, and having to keep a secret of that magnitude from Sam had to have been eating him alive. Now that the weight of the secrecy is off his shoulders, even though he's still got to deal with the actual secret itself, it's got to be easier for him ...
ext_1981: (Catch-22)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 06:57 am (UTC)(link)
Oh, and I neglected to mention how much I loved the brother-byplay all through the last part of the episode -- not just the banter at the end, but also Dean's terror when he thought Sam had been killed, and then clutching at him when he was untied and checking to see if he was okay ...
ext_3572: (Default)

[identity profile] xparrot.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 06:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah...Dean's code vs. Dean's family loyalty isn't much of a choice, really. Especially now...Dean's code really seems to be more loyalty to his father than anything, and now that John's gone...Dean still cares about helping people, but his faith to the 'cause' in general is crumbling. But now he's got Sam hanging onto it, so...

Totally agree, too, that it was keeping the secret, as much as the secret itself, that was destroying Dean. That was a terrible burden John put on his son, with that promise. Now that it's come out, it is easier - especially since Sam can joke about. I loved that. That's trust, that's faith, that's love, when Sam hears that Dean has been told - ordered - to kill him if he has to, and he can still crack, "What? You'll kill me?" (and some of the trust there, even, is that Sam knows if he does 'go darkside' that Dean will stop him...well, Sam believes it, I think. In all honesty, I'm not totally sure Dean does, or would...)

--Loved, too, that as soon as he gets in a tight spot Sam calls Dean right away. Dean's still and always his big brother...

And oh, man, the thought-dead, the clutching, Dean's desperation. Yow. What an ep!!

[identity profile] derry667.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 09:47 am (UTC)(link)
Well, I agree, although my enthusiasm is a bit more effusive.

In fact, it got to 5000+ words of effusive... *sigh*

;-P
ext_1981: (Default)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 09:55 am (UTC)(link)
*hee* I just got done reading your post, actually!

I could have gotten a lot longer, but I decided that I didn't really want to, because the gist of it is summed up above. However, I'm glad to see it's not just me who is seeing sort of a return to normalcy in the Brothers Wincester. And thinking about our discussion of turning points, I wonder if this episode actually could have *been* that turning point. That's another reason why I really want next week's episode now ... I'd like to know! *aaargh*

[identity profile] derry667.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 01:19 pm (UTC)(link)
I could have gotten a lot longer, but I decided that I didn't really want to, because the gist of it is summed up above.

I probably could have made mine shorter, but there was what I originally wanted to say (which was mainly squee). And then there was what I was spurned on to say after a brief conversatin with a friend (which sparked the ranting). Yes, a remarkably brief one actually, considering how long some of the ranting went on for. LOL!

And thinking about our discussion of turning points, I wonder if this episode actually could have *been* that turning point. That's another reason why I really want next week's episode now ... I'd like to know! *aaargh*

Ditto!

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 05:23 pm (UTC)(link)
okay, okay, FINE!!!! Guess I'll have to watch the show, darn it. How lost would I be if I started now?
ext_1981: (Wiseguy-Vinnie Frank hug)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 09:41 pm (UTC)(link)
Ahahaha! *rubs hands together* Another one falls to the dark side!

While we are right in the middle of a story arc, this show really isn't *that* single-arc in the way that, say, Lost is. It's episodic enough that you could probably start watching now and follow it. And there's a handy little "last week on..." thing at the start of every episode.

I'm glad that I've gotten to see the whole thing in order because I hate spoilers and like to have things revealed sequentially, and there are several big twists that have happened. But since you're not a spoiler-phobe like me (you aren't, right?) that shouldn't be a big sticking point.

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 10:20 pm (UTC)(link)
I adore spoilers. LOL!!

[identity profile] derry667.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 12:49 am (UTC)(link)
ROTFLMAO!

And [livejournal.com profile] friendshipper knows exactly why.

And another one's gone, another one's gone.
Another one bites the dust...


*snicker*

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 01:08 am (UTC)(link)
Hm. I take it you are somewhat responsible for this?
ext_1981: (Wiseguy-Vinnie Frank hug)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 01:18 am (UTC)(link)
*snort* Yes. She's one of the main two who's responsible for "helping" me find YET ANOTHER black hole for my copious free time...

[identity profile] derry667.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 02:13 am (UTC)(link)
Responsible? I'd never say that!

Heck, no! I'm an innocent victim in all this, as much she is and you yourself.

It's just that the words "Oh for heaven's sake! OKAY! I'll watch it!" are hauntingly familiar. Like 3 months ago or so, I too was just minding my own fandom business and wham... It's like a virus or something. And people are totally irresponsible about spreading it to their friends!

LOL!

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 02:20 am (UTC)(link)
*chuckles* Apparently "Heroes" spread the same way...

[identity profile] derry667.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 02:27 am (UTC)(link)
No! Don't say that!

I've already got friends waving that one in my face and my brother watches it too.

I'm trying to resist that one! Thank you very much!

Is not my headlong plunge into this latest brain-sucking fandom enough for you people?!?!?

(Yes, I do think that's kinda ironic...)

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 03:27 am (UTC)(link)
OH!!!OHOHOHOH!!!! Crap, you have GOT to watch Heroes if there is any possible way you can. Easy enough to catch up on. If you like sci-fi fantasy at ALL, yes, watch the show. You'll fall in love with Hiro if nothing else, he's a gem. All the characters are great. Definitely watch it!

[identity profile] parisindy.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 08:49 pm (UTC)(link)
SQUeaaaaaaaaa ANOTHER supernatural fan i'm not alone
ext_1981: (Wiseguy-Vinnie Frank hug)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 09:42 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm a very recent convert, after months of having like-minded friends dangle the show in front of me going "waaaaaatch thiiiiiiiis" ... *grin* I'm definitely glad that I finally gave it a try!

[identity profile] parisindy.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 09:58 pm (UTC)(link)
okay one question ...dean or sam?

(crosses fingers for another dean whumper)

[identity profile] parisindy.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 10:13 pm (UTC)(link)
Sweet ...going to write fan fic?
ext_1981: (Catch-22)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 10:17 pm (UTC)(link)
Probably not, actually ... at least not at this point. So far, this isn't turning out to be a series that really makes me crave fic, either to read it or write it. Canon is doing such a good job of delivering on the stuff that I would normally read fic for! :D
ext_1981: (Default)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 10:49 pm (UTC)(link)
Well, I don't think I could write a lot of fic in two fandoms without going nuts anyway. *grin*

[identity profile] parisindy.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 12:00 am (UTC)(link)
hehehehe .. a girl can dream hehe

if you want some links for some good supernatural fanfic reads let me know :)

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 02:22 am (UTC)(link)
pfft. Come on. I've got stories going on in Sg1, SGA, Rent, and Horatio Hornblower. And you're like WAAAAY better than me. :)

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 10:23 pm (UTC)(link)
Huh. I never thought about it that way, I mean I'm a fan of a lot of things that I don't write or read fic for, and I've wondered why I don't. I've tried reading fic for "Heroes", for example, and I can't do it (course that may have to do with the fic subject matter).

If there are no holes to fill, the fics won't come. If things are being laid out on the show, there's no need to wonder "what if"...and again if the show is creative enough, it probably won't tap into my own creative juices. Hrmph.

And if the show is THAT GOOD...yeah, I'll check it out.
ext_1981: (Default)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 10:48 pm (UTC)(link)
To give you an idea, this show came highly recommended to me by two different h/c fanatics ... *grin*

Like you, there are certain fandoms that make me look for fic, and quite a lot of others where I really enjoy canon, but have no particular desire for fic. I've discussed this with [livejournal.com profile] xparrot and what she has pointed out is true of her, seems to be true of me as well: that when canon supplies what I want, I'm not especially inclined to seek out fic. Another thing that seems to affect it is that when canon changes quickly (as is true of Supernatural, and also Lost or others of that type) I'm not really inclined to look for fic, either -- it just changes so fast that fic rapidly becomes obsolete.

I think you pegged it exactly, because writing fic (for me) is all about plugging holes and extending upon canon. It's playing the "what if"? game. And if there really *aren't* a lot of holes to fill, if canon actually shows you how the characters would react under various circumstances and fills in the gaps in their backstories, then there's not much compulsion for me to seek out fic.

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 11:03 pm (UTC)(link)
So...can past eps be downloaded anywhere? Cause this last post has really made me want to watch. *eg*
ext_1981: (Default)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-14 11:08 pm (UTC)(link)
You can get this season's eps on iTunes for $1.99 each. Or you can use Bittorrent -- if you don't know any good torrent sites, I can email you. So far Bittorrent is the only way I've found to get AVIs for this particular series -- I hate it (compared to downloading directly) but it's been doing the job ...

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 12:37 am (UTC)(link)
I've used mininova. Takes freakin forever to dl. Is this iTunes a thing that will download to the harddrive, or is it one of those things where you have to dl into a device?
ext_1981: (Default)

[identity profile] friendshipper.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 01:21 am (UTC)(link)
iTunes is a program that dl's to the hard drive. The files aren't very versatile, though ... in Windows, the only things we've found that can play them are iTunes itself, or Quicktime Player. (My husband has Windows and Linux; I have a Mac, which is iTunes' native environment and makes it somewhat easier to use.)

iTunes downloads WAY faster than Bittorrent. It usually takes me anywhere from several hours to a full day to get an episode from a torrent.

[identity profile] parisindy.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 12:04 am (UTC)(link)
i read a lot of different fandoms
but writing them is a whole different call of wax so i totally get that.

I was so involved with the andromeda fandom for years, i wrote tons of stories for that. I have written 1 1/2 atlantis fics and one mini supenatural one and one O.c.

but really they are crap lol, its just like anything else... once you get used to writing for one set of characters... you get to know them so well its hard to write anything else.

i've been trying to write original fic for a while now bit even thats a struggle.

Makes me wonder if i was only ever meant to write andromeda fic and it thats where i should leave it.

[identity profile] leenys.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 12:39 am (UTC)(link)
You just haven't got your swing back. I was most active in SGA fics, but there are plently of fandoms I've not written in, and have no desire to. You just need to find a fandom that gets that creativity flowing again.

Kam :)

[identity profile] parisindy.livejournal.com 2007-01-15 01:28 am (UTC)(link)
true enough.. and i guess its getting to know the characters as well as you know the old ones

((hugs))
~Paris