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Another thought about B5 5x18
I will be going back to answer recent comments, but first, one more stray B5 thought with spoilers through 5x18.
The thing I've been thinking about off and on all day is how season 5 repeatedly sends Londo and G'Kar through cycles of being forced to deal with the personal repercussions of the Centauri bombardment of the Narn homeworld, in ways that push them further apart by very validly bringing up Londo's/his people's culpability and G'Kar's equally valid anger about it (the fight in the bomb shelter on B5, and then the even more serious rift when Na'Toth is describing her own much more recent experiences in the assault on Narn; you can almost feel the distance between them throughout that episode).
But I can't help feeling like, as well as giving them opportunities to work through their checkered and bloody history one painful argument at a time, all of that helps set up the eventual denouement when they are both caught in the bombardment of Centauri Prime by the Narns and allies.
Because the circle finally closes there, and rather than being pushed apart, they're brought together by shared sympathy, friendship, and worry, completely apart from loyalty to their people, their history, or the various fighting factions. (Which obviously are still important, to both of them; just not in that moment.) G'Kar is there under the orbital bombardment by his own side because he's chosen to be there, to protect his friend. And Londo, whose role in the earlier episodes dealing with this motif has been much more ambiguous (ally and enemy both, at times), doesn't even hesitate before diving in and saving him; regardless of whatever else is going on, he doesn't pause and he's not afraid and he has no other priorities before that one. He shows up so quickly in G'Kar's cell that he must have headed there when the ships first started firing, realizing that G'Kar would be helpless - before looking after his own people, before doing anything else to try to stop it; he implicitly promised that nothing bad was going to happen to G'Kar in that cell, and he'll be there to stop it even if it means a few tons of rocks falling on his head.
The way that the last few episodes in the season bring out their personal loyalty above all else just kills me, especially since it has such a sharply truncated and painful ending when Londo is forced back, in the worst possible way, into the straitjacket of duty, planet, and Imperial throne. But before that, they get this. (And G'Kar's quietly wondering, "I would be dead if not for you. You risked your life to save mine.") And I feel like it's set up by those early episodes that remind us, and them, how far apart they are, how different their experiences are up to this point - none of which matters when there are bombs falling on both their heads.
It might be their last close orbit before spiraling much further apart, but it's such a good one.
The thing I've been thinking about off and on all day is how season 5 repeatedly sends Londo and G'Kar through cycles of being forced to deal with the personal repercussions of the Centauri bombardment of the Narn homeworld, in ways that push them further apart by very validly bringing up Londo's/his people's culpability and G'Kar's equally valid anger about it (the fight in the bomb shelter on B5, and then the even more serious rift when Na'Toth is describing her own much more recent experiences in the assault on Narn; you can almost feel the distance between them throughout that episode).
But I can't help feeling like, as well as giving them opportunities to work through their checkered and bloody history one painful argument at a time, all of that helps set up the eventual denouement when they are both caught in the bombardment of Centauri Prime by the Narns and allies.
Because the circle finally closes there, and rather than being pushed apart, they're brought together by shared sympathy, friendship, and worry, completely apart from loyalty to their people, their history, or the various fighting factions. (Which obviously are still important, to both of them; just not in that moment.) G'Kar is there under the orbital bombardment by his own side because he's chosen to be there, to protect his friend. And Londo, whose role in the earlier episodes dealing with this motif has been much more ambiguous (ally and enemy both, at times), doesn't even hesitate before diving in and saving him; regardless of whatever else is going on, he doesn't pause and he's not afraid and he has no other priorities before that one. He shows up so quickly in G'Kar's cell that he must have headed there when the ships first started firing, realizing that G'Kar would be helpless - before looking after his own people, before doing anything else to try to stop it; he implicitly promised that nothing bad was going to happen to G'Kar in that cell, and he'll be there to stop it even if it means a few tons of rocks falling on his head.
The way that the last few episodes in the season bring out their personal loyalty above all else just kills me, especially since it has such a sharply truncated and painful ending when Londo is forced back, in the worst possible way, into the straitjacket of duty, planet, and Imperial throne. But before that, they get this. (And G'Kar's quietly wondering, "I would be dead if not for you. You risked your life to save mine.") And I feel like it's set up by those early episodes that remind us, and them, how far apart they are, how different their experiences are up to this point - none of which matters when there are bombs falling on both their heads.
It might be their last close orbit before spiraling much further apart, but it's such a good one.
no subject
Short of one of their earliest, spiteful clashes, I find it almost impossible to picture Londo actually leaving G'Kar to die, but I agree that even as recently as the top of Season 4 it wouldn't have been that heedless instinctive sprint before any other consideration. Even after he's got G'Kar to relative safety: "I will call for a doctor, then I have to find the Regent." The order of priorities.
I also think that up until this point, G'Kar had thought of himself as by far the more physically capable of the two of them.
And traditionally it's been true! Londo isn't physically incompetent—he's got the constitution of an truck in light of everything he's put his body through—but anything like the still-skilled duel with Urza Jaddo or punching out Refa's security in "And the Rock Cried Out . . ." or even the plan to assassinate Cartagia himself is just much rarer for him than politicking his way out of a situation and when Season 3 answered the question of which one of them would win in a fistfight, it wasn't Londo.
Londo defending him from the Centauri guards shook him a little and impressed him, but it was also within his mental framework of how they were supposed to work. But Londo physically rescuing him, picking him up and dragging to safety completely rewired him. He literally got swept off his feet.
Yes! (Aw.) (Augh.)
no subject
Yeah, I think I put that badly - I agree that he wouldn't have left him to die, probably not at any point since they've known each other. (G'Kar canonically *would* leave Londo to die in early season 3, but I really don't think Londo has ever actually hated him, or wanted him dead.) But having G'Kar as his #1 goal when there are bombs falling on his city, and the palace, and him - that's fairly new.
Even after he's got G'Kar to relative safety: "I will call for a doctor, then I have to find the Regent." The order of priorities.
Yes. That. Exactly.
I did hope that we'd get to see another instance of duelist Londo or fighter pilot Londo once more before the end - he's just so much fun when he does get to display some actual physical badassery! - and while we didn't get that, I will very happily take this.
he's got the constitution of an truck in light of everything he's put his body through
He does! I really think that surviving 15 years of Drakh infestation to die at G'Kar's hands, rather than by suicide or heart failure or drinking or one of 10,000 other possible causes, is down to his toughness both mental and physical. The heart attack that he has in canon is due to guilt rather than physical failure (and I still can't get over that this it's actual canon that he almost dies from sheer guilt and grief; what is this show even).
no subject
He does head seriously off to assassinate him in "Midnight on the Firing Line"! Having already gotten into a dramatic public brawl where they were literally, ironically at one another's throats. Tensions run so high during the crisis on Raghesh III—and there's family and guilt involved as well as political face—if Londo had been presented then with an opportunity to lock the Narn ambassador in a transport tube and throw away the key, he probably would have taken it. But he never tries it again. By the time G'Kar really is being hurt by the consequences of Londo's decisions, it isn't personal, which is one of the reasons it's worse.
But having G'Kar as his #1 goal when there are bombs falling on his city, and the palace, and him - that's fairly new.
It is a little of duellist Londo, fighter-pilot Londo, honestly: absolutely reckless in the face of danger. Paso leati.
I did hope that we'd get to see another instance of duelist Londo or fighter pilot Londo once more before the end - he's just so much fun when he does get to display some actual physical badassery! - and while we didn't get that, I will very happily take this.
I can also nudge you toward the possibility of fic where it comes into play.
I really think that surviving 15 years of Drakh infestation to die at G'Kar's hands, rather than by suicide or heart failure or drinking or one of 10,000 other possible causes, is down to his toughness both mental and physical.
Seriously. As you pointed out, the Regent lasted just about a year and half under his Keeper and it wasn't just that he was planned for disposal as part of the Drakh seizure of Centauri Prime, he was actively failing. Londo was stubborn.
The heart attack that he has in canon is due to guilt rather than physical failure (and I still can't get over that this it's actual canon that he almost dies from sheer guilt and grief; what is this show even).
You understand why I keep saying that encountering this show as my first real example of American long-form television screwed me up for life!
no subject
Ha. Right. I forgot about that. Actually, thinking about it, that's the most direct time but not the only time ... there's also trying to get G'Kar sent home to be executed, and he probably at least went into the Cartagia team-up with the idea that the risk of G'Kar dying was worth it. (Never quite over the stricken look on his face when G'Kar is presented to him in chains at the start of all of that, though - they aren't friends or even allies, but Londo didn't want that.)
Anyway, though, the turnaround from being fully willing to accept G'Kar's death as a side effect of his scheming, to throwing all other considerations aside to make sure he's safe, is really something.
It is a little of duellist Londo, fighter-pilot Londo, honestly: absolutely reckless in the face of danger. Paso leati.
That is so true! I love that side of him. (Fic will definitely be considered.)
You understand why I keep saying that encountering this show as my first real example of American long-form television screwed me up for life!
I can certainly see why! Especially at a time when very few other shows were doing anything similar to this. It's not completely alone, but it was rare, and I can't think of another example from that era's SFF genre TV; everything else I can think of were more on the serious drama or crime show end of things.
no subject
Both true! Still feels qualitatively different to me from a hands-on murder attempt, which is why it's so interesting to me that he tried one.
That is so true! I love that side of him. (Fic will definitely be considered.)
(w00t!)
It's not completely alone, but it was rare, and I can't think of another example from that era's SFF genre TV; everything else I can think of were more on the serious drama or crime show end of things.